Affiliate Site Content with the KGR - The Keyword Golden Ratio, Part 2 – DS006 #DougShow #Best Education Page #Online Earning

you say one of the key secrets to

success is patience and patience

definitely doesn't just mean doing

something and waiting it means never

giving up you know like having that

tenacity to figure it out

yeah it could look like stubbornness

from from the outside sometimes but hey

what's going on this is the Doug show

and welcome to part two of the key word

golden ratio and that intro was me

talking with my friend Dom Wells from

human proof designs and the human proof

podcast now if you haven't listened to

the previous episode which is the key

word golden ratio part one you should

definitely listen to the previous

episode to put this episode in context

so I have to thank my friend Dom for

letting me rebroadcast this baby he

interviewed me a while back and we did a

two-part series first part was primarily

around the K G R as we call the keyword

golden ratio for short and sort of the

details around the formula finding key

words and that sort of thing this

episode part two is mainly around

executing after you found all these key

words so we talked about content we

talked about my team of hiring you know

freelance writers how I do that and by

the way you can get all the templates

that I use for hiring people actually

writing the content the materials and

information that I provide to the

freelancers so they know you know what I

need them to do so you can get a hold

all of that if you go to niche site

project comm there's a green button

click it enter your name and email

address and then I'll send you an email

with a link to all the good stuff that

we're talking about so I'm gonna send it

over to DOM here in a second the quick

note there is not going to be a Q&A

section at the end of this episode it

will be the next episode because there

were so many questions so listen to

to the interview yeah what's like the

first thing you do when you've got this

data or what are you considering as

you're researching the actual keywords

in terms of turning them into content

okay good question I have a small team

of writers that I sort of work with like

on an ad-hoc basis but let's just sort

of consider it for like an individual

and then maybe we could talk about the

team like later since it does add a

little more complexity so on the most

basic level you know what we have at

this point is a list of keywords and

they're usually you know not just words

but they're actually phrases like the

example we've been working with you know

through the last episode was best water

bottles for yoga so we could sort of you

know think about that maybe there's

several iterations you know best water

bottles for you know hot yoga and you

know I don't do yoga so maybe that's I

shouldn't use that example but we'll

just keep going with it so essentially

we have a list of keywords and at that

point I'll just give you some like Ross

specs on what I'm sort of looking for so

I have a template and we'll also assume

that these are affiliate you know sort

of review based non informational posts

so these are affiliate based reviews so

essentially I have like a template I

call it the you know perfect Amazon

review format and you know we can share

that in the show notes and you could get

that for free and sort of you know a

short guide that I use to help write

that and it's really sort of modular

it's pretty easy to write these types of

reviews and I will write a 600 to 1000

word post for each of the key words so

let's say we found ten key words that

output will be ten articles so any

questions so far done yeah I guess I

mean it'll make sense but if you found

key words which were particularly

similar like let's go with your yoga

example I'm just using

as you are about if you found like best

water bottle for yoga or best yoga pants

for men best yoga pants for women for

example sure would you group the kind of

for men and the for women keywords

together or would that still be two

separate articles okay awesome question

this is sort of counterintuitive but I

don't group them so I'll publish them

separately and we could talk about the

consequences of that in a second and

what to do about it but I published them

separately so like I said 10 keywords

you get 10 different articles is the

output okay makes it easier yeah

actually because I I know some of the

questions that you might ask so I'll

tell you about what might happen and

then you could ask questions as we go

sound good let's do all right

so Dom you're probably thinking to

yourself what about keyword

cannibalization and if you're not

familiar with the term that means like

you're sort of taking search results

from your own site right so your example

is yoga pants for men and yoga pants for

women let's say for some reason that the

yoga pants for men article is ranking

for both of the search terms yoga pants

for women and the search term yoga pants

for men so a little wordy but

essentially the wrong page is ranking

right so that is a real risk and it

can't happen and actually it does happen

it happens some percentage of the time

it's less than you would think but more

than you would hope so what you do right

or what I do is I'll publish the

articles all separately so 10 articles

are out there and then I'll wait I'll

wait for like a month or six weeks and

see what Google does and if for example

my men's article is ranking for terms

that I don't want it to rank for

maybe I'll go and adjust some of the

headings the subheadings to the h2 and

three content on the article that is not

ranking to maybe make it a little bit

stronger as far as the keyword that I'm

trying to rank it for maybe I'll add

some inter links within the site using

anchor text that can help it rank for

the term in which I hope it to rank for

and see what happens you know I'll go to

the Google search console fetch that

particular page to you know re index it

and then wait another you know week or

two weeks I'm not in a rush in any case

here and see what Google does at the end

of the day right it still may be the

case that Google is ranking the page

that you are not trying to rank or sorry

ranking a term for which a page that I

think I'm talking myself in circles here

Don but the thing is Google is still

ranking the wrong page so what you can

do actually before I go on do you want

to clarify that at all since I talked

myself into a circle yeah because I've

had these experiences as well I'll give

another example which might help explain

it to anyone who's listening and

scratching their head so I had a website

which was about darts and one post

targeted best soft tip ducks and one

post targeted best steel tip does and to

me it made sense to do them as separate

posts but what happened was best soft

tip ducks ranked page one for the search

term best soft tip dance and it also

ranked page one for the search term best

steel tip to us and this was very

frustrating because first of all it only

ranked like position nine and it wasn't

going to rank higher because it wasn't

quite optimized for steel tip it was

optimized for soft tip and in fact it

was a miracle it got that high in the

first place and I didn't so it wasn't

even get any higher and also it probably

wasn't going to convert because if

anyone clicks on that article they'd be

like but this is about soft tip so I

wanted steel tips so yeah it's quite a

frustrating thing and I've seen it

happen quite a few times and I've done

some of those things you mentioned like

I try to go through that soft tip

article and think where is the word

steel

remove this word and then I might do

some more internal linking to the steel

tip 1 I might make the steel tip 1 more

optimized maybe add 500 words to it and

sometimes that's enough and Google kind

of you know it catches on it's it's a

machine sometimes it takes time to

figure it out and sometimes yeah like

you say it just doesn't and you just

kind of stuck there thinking well maybe

I'm not gonna rank for that keyword so

I'm curious you kind of seem like you're

leading into saying something else.the

yeah so one day it hit me why fight with

Google it just seems so obvious now in

hindsight but I thought well if Google

is telling me it's gonna rank that page

for the term that's not even optimized

maybe I know I'd never even mentioned

the word on there like the steel-tipped

art example you gave and I just moved

the content over so I create a new

section on the page so in you know your

example you know I would have moved the

steel-tipped content over to the soft

tip content create a new section in

there maybe add a new intro so that

people know that they're in the right

place and they could skip ahead to you

know the section that they're interested

in and then I would simply 301 redirect

the old article in which I've moved the

content from and then redirect it to you

know the new page so if I did any link

building of any kind or any sort of

other you know just ranking signals they

would point to the page which is now

consolidated and it seems to work

alright you know at that point that page

is actually optimized in some way for

that term the Google was ranking it for

though you weren't intending on breaking

it for that term okay cool yeah I've

done that once or twice and I did the

301 as well because I thought you know

don't want to I mean this article is not

ranking anyway but I don't want to kind

of risk hurting lean the other articles

so it's just cleaner to 301 and I think

I saw it work once or twice but then I

saw it not work once or twice so you

know like you say like you never know

what Google's gonna do

I sure I can certainly see why you would

want to do that because now the page is

optimized and it's like if it got to the

bottom of page one without being

optimized now you optimize it it's

probably going to skyrocket to the top

plus your visitors are actually gonna

find every information they want which

at the end of the day is you know the

whole point of the site yeah why then I

can probably tell what the answer is

going to be but for the benefit of the

audience why would you then not just put

those two articles as one article from

the very beginning so my thought is well

you know what that approach would be

valid too however if you publish the

content with keywords combined into one

post and it's stuck at say you know

position six or something in my opinion

it's more work to have to move it out

and then you're not really like you have

no proof that that was the reason

holding it back so as I say it out loud

I realized that when you can say that in

the other direction as well and I you

know I could argue that same point in

opposition of me but you know for this

exercise of you know kgr content it

worked pretty well and then once I moved

the content over you know after I tried

to reach you know the post it wasn't

ranking as well as it should have I move

it over and then 301 redirect it and

then I don't worry about it anymore okay

yeah I guess like you never know when

dude was gonna do this so if you start

out with all your content all your

keywords on separate articles you're

kind of diversifying a bit more in

increasing your chances as well like if

you have all ten keywords on one article

and for whatever reason Google doesn't

like that article then that's ten

keywords you might not rank for but if

you spread it out then you know you only

need to be successful with 50% and

that's five keywords that you're ranking

for so yes yes in to be fair I have not

actually tried at the you know the other

way where you sort of group the content

together and I I'm involved in some

other site

as well and they have that sort of

content model where it's super long

content and typically for me those are

gonna be the keywords that have those

larger search volumes so you know I

definitely have a spread of content in

these particular you know kgr content

these are the you know the shorter

versions and you know I'm splitting them

up it's very granular overall yeah so

that's an interesting point as well I

guess like it depends on what kind of

keyword you're doing like if you're

targeting a 4,000 word monthly search

keyword and you're gonna write this like

5,000 word post because you really want

to you know make it like this kind of

pillar content on your website maybe

with that one it would make sense to put

all the other iterations and kind of LSI

keywords all on the same article but

when you're doing your these kind of

low-hanging fruit kgr keywords it makes

sense to kind of just it's like you're

throwing the seeds and seeing what's

growing so I can follow the logic into

doing it that way I think it's a lot

easier to organize your thoughts as well

like sometimes I've done keyword

research and I found 50 keywords and I

think these could all quite conceivably

be 50 posts but they could also be 20

posts or they could also be one post or

they could also be three posts and I

just I spent three hours thinking okay

I'm gonna make these ones one post and

then fit into it right I think you kind

of get this paralysis by analysis thing

you know where you're just so uncertain

about the best way to organize it and

you never know until you actually

publish the content anyway so I like the

idea of just get the keywords and turn

them all into posts yep and for me you

know the way I sort of like built the

you know my ad-hoc team you know they're

all freelancers I don't have anyone on

staff like full-time or anything like

that but you know working with

individual articles and you know smaller

pieces of work sort of made it easier to

have this ad hoc system where I could

say

and more editors and writers pretty

quickly without having to rely on them

for a 10,000 word posts and other

content and everything associated with

that versus a thousand word where it's

like a pretty small segment so it's sort

of a little it's a little risk

management since you know sometimes

writers or freelancers in general

disappear and don't do the work that you

originally hired them for so yeah I mean

we have about 50 60 different writers on

our payroll so I totally feel those

pains and it's definitely a lot easier

to find people that can write 600 words

decent content than it is to find

someone who can write like 4,000 word

Keystone yep so that's kind of a good

point as well in that maybe you don't

have to do things the best way and maybe

there isn't even a best way to do it on

Google but as long as you're actually

able to do it then you know you're gonna

get results like your results speak for

themselves maybe how you did it isn't

the best way to do it but if your site

only 15,000 and you can you know you get

the right to say you don't care right

Thanks yeah I think that's a key point

right so like I sort of you know

organized this in a way that was easiest

for me but you know if you're looking at

this and you think Doug's an idiot for

doing certain things a certain way

definitely test it you know like try it

how it makes most the most sense to you

and maybe you know grouping the content

in a more logical way can be helpful

right maybe you know maybe you silo this

content so you have some pages and

subpages like child pages on your

WordPress you know I guess installation

I don't know the right word but you're

using pages and subpages and you're

using like a pretty tight side load type

structure and architecture now I'll tell

you that takes more time to manage and

you have to think about things ahead of

time but you know if you structure in

that way then you have tons of relevancy

like all built in and you know maybe

that

more sense to you so you give that a try

yeah yeah I mean something I find myself

telling people over over again is just

test it and see what works I mean I've

had my results and I don't know whether

I've tried building sites a certain way

and not seeing a modicum of success with

that and then someone else says that's

the only way to do it and then I've had

success doing it my way you've had

success doing it your way so the one

lesson people need to learn is just try

it and see if it works for you and find

what does work for you and I think even

in your article that we mentioned you

say one of the key secrets to success is

patience and patience definitely doesn't

just mean doing something or waiting it

means never giving up you know like

having that tenacity to figure it out

yeah it can look like stubbornness from

from the outside sometimes but you know

if you're taking the information and

feedback that you are getting and

adapting what you're doing then you know

you should be able to work out you know

the system that works for you and you

know I'm sure if people try this and it

doesn't quite work you know how I

describe it I'm sure there's a tweak

they can make and you know maybe it'll

work better for them but in my you know

specific data points it seems to be

working pretty well yeah and you know so

the last point on this before we we jump

back into more of the kind of

practicalities of the content I think

there are many different case studies

out there and like you said in the

previous episode sometimes the person

has had this success because they've

been around a while and they've managed

to succeed with it but I think also

there are some people who they just did

something once and it's almost like they

caught lightning in a bottle like they

teach this method and I think either

you're not being a hundred percent

truthful about what you did or you've

got really really lucky and no one else

is going to be able to kind of recreate

this but what we're talking about is

definitely not that so you know I'm just

going to say to people yeah maybe you

won't get a hundred percent the results

that don't got maybe you'll get better

maybe you'll get a forty percent but

like the theory is sound and it makes

sense so just do it and see what happens

so anyway let's go back into the content

so you kind of get stuff that's like 600

words or a thousand words how do you

like do you have a publishing schedule

or do you just publish it as it comes

out or like you know you mentioned

earlier you don't launch a site with 50

articles so what do you share follow so

in this particular case you know this

site you know had been around for a

little while I think about a year or so

if I recall when I started publishing it

so essentially I was publishing it as

fast as I could and I'll go ahead and

describe my team a little bit but just

to give you an idea of the publishing of

it I would publish you know 5 to 20

articles all at once so I was batching

all of my publishing in one day so I

know that some people will say you

really should publish things once a week

and you should space it out it proves

consistency I've never I don't know if

there's any like data to back that up

but I just published everything as soon

as I could as fast as I could because I

knew that this post would get traffic

right away so there was no reason for me

to hold it and there were no ill effects

and it's been you know five six months

so I think should be okay my team was

sort of I started small so I started

with one writer and then I hired another

writer once I you know had the training

process down and I was happy with the

word from the first writer and then it

would hire you know a couple more I had

maybe about four writers working for me

at one point I wanted to stop doing the

editing and sort of the formatting and

kind of a setup inside WordPress for

each post so I asked one of my writers

if she wanted to do you know a little a

little more high end work come on hourly

instead of you know a fixed bid for her

articles and she did so I you know again

I had to train her to do editing in

WordPress and learn how to use WordPress

she never used it before

and that worked out great she's still

working for me right now in fact

so she's a us-based I pay between eight

and ten dollars an hour for the content

manager slash editor and she takes care

of you know actually editing of the

grammar she makes sure that the content

is in the voice of the site she'll grab

pictures from like Flickr Creative

Commons she'll add some calls to action

she'll add links to Amazon she'll add a

YouTube video and then draft everything

for me so it's just in draft mode and I

can go in to WordPress

check out the drafts it usually takes me

about three to four minutes to look over

an article and you know make sure it

looks ok and make sure the links are

going where they were supposed to and

then I just hit publish so like I said I

would just go into my dashboard and

publish as many things as I could okay

lots of food for thought there yeah I

mean I've heard that too about it's

better to be consistent and you know is

better to publish three posts a week for

six weeks than it is to publish

everything at once and then do nothing

for five weeks and it makes sense but

I've never seen any evidence of that

maybe it used to be the case or maybe it

only works better with a new site or

with an established site I don't know

but like the same as you like I'll just

publish them as soon as they're ready

because I I hate looking into WordPress

and publishing them so I'll be like okay

let's just get this over with yeah I

also yeah because Google's going to find

some posts after an hour and it's going

to find some posts after a week and

they're all going to take different

times to kind of marinate in Google so

you know just start the clock like as

soon as you can you know just thinking

about it I wonder if that's sort of an

artifact from you know people giving

advice about starting a blog where you

know really it's important to be

consistent and not give up and then it's

important to you know sort of commit to

publish once per week or something but

you and I are building at least in this

case we're building affiliate sites to

do a specific thing and you know that

sort of consistent

it doesn't matter so I wonder if it's

just an artifact of like you know advice

to bloggers yeah it could be or it could

be from the days before there was more

of a notable sandbox or it could be from

the days when authorship was a thing you

know

so it's sound advice so I'm not going to

kind of destroy it too much but I feel

like it maybe actually isn't a hundred

percent applicable to this kind of

website yeah so something you touched

upon and you have someone edit your

content and everything so I assume you

do you worry too much about making

everything look pretty and amazing with

like thrive themes or anything or or is

it just not this type of content you

just want it to be well formatted and

have links and then let it do its thing

yeah well formatted and you know there

are you know calls to action you know

hey check out this specific item on

Amazon but you know I I don't have a

flair for design or anything like that

but the site looks clean and you know

that's kind of my approach these days is

less is more you just want to you know

let the user and visitor be able to read

the content as far as like making it

pretty and using you know thrive or

other sort of visual editors I don't do

that it would take more time but I don't

know that it would actually bring more

revenue and the ultimate goal of course

now that said I haven't done you know

crl the conversion rate optimisation and

I'm just starting to learn about that

actually for niche sites and I mean when

it comes down to it

you would have to do like a be testing

and check if you know a pretty format

actually boost conversions or not a lot

of times you know things that you would

test in an a/b test don't actually

change much and it other things do and

you just never know which one it is so

overall I'm not doing anything fancy

it's pretty much straight up you know

WordPress post the other thing we like

thrive is I feel it is I used thrive

especially for like sales pages and

stuff but

it slows down my pages so I've

definitely ripped it off of pages

because after I checked the load time

and then remove thrive content builder

from you know particular page and then

check the load time it was so dramatic

that I started taking thrive off

everywhere except where I have that yeah

that's interesting I found that thrive

it's an amazing plugin but it is quite

bloated in some ways like the fact that

you have to upload the plug-in via FTP a

lot of the time or cPanel yeah actually

if all the images inside forever were

optimized the file size would only be

about 8 megabytes because we optimized

it once because my I'm so frustrated

with having to do it every time he just

optimized it but then of course thrive

updated the plug-in like a week later so

in my kind of philosophy with using

thrive is I'm not going to mess around

with stuff like that until the articles

ranking and maybe it's in position one

and or you know it's getting a lot of

traffic and I'm thinking let me see if I

can do CRO but I'm certainly not going

to do that in the beginning what I'll

normally do is maybe if I find a site is

getting like a thousand searches a month

and OH rather it's getting a thousand

visitors a month and maybe it's only

making a bit of money I might find what

normally is the case where the new site

is that like eighty percent of that

traffic is all going to one post so then

I might go in and see if I can play

around with thrive but when I first

publish stuff I'm just gonna hit publish

and let it rank and then I'll worry

about moving call to actions and stuff

like that yeah because you don't want to

you don't want to waste ten hours a day

for something that might have no result

exactly now I have a question for you

Dom when you do make those changes are

you using the CRO tool or how are you

measuring the impact it depends usually

I'm kind of lazy so what I'll do is if a

post is getting like five hundred

visitors a month and it makes two

hundred dollars I'll make some changes

changes with thrive so it's quite easy

for me to undo those changes later and

if the next month that makes more money

then you know I'll consider it success

but if it only makes $10 more who knows

or if it only makes $10 less who knows

because you know stuff fluctuates yeah

usually if I'm testing a specific post

then I will give that post its own

tracking ID in Amazon so that I can see

like I know exactly which page made

which sales right but I found with my

shaving site by just changing three

pages

I went from fifty dollars a month to 500

dollars a month

almost almost overnight and it only took

me about two hours really yeah because I

basically made some boxes like some

fancy call-to-action boxes and then I

just copied those boxes to other pages

because you can save templates in thrive

guide sure but I've done the same thing

with another site and not seen any any

improvement so that's why I think all

right well I'm gonna wait and once I get

to a point where I think this site is in

a position where I want to try and do

see all right then I'll do it because

every site is different every audience

is different and there are certainly

some best practices and some things that

you can test first but wait you never

know what's gonna happen in testing

exactly exactly and I don't want to

digress too much but I'm working on

another another project actually and

even I guess more profitable site and

you know there's actually less content

on that site but it's more profitable

because of the you know the keywords in

the niche but you know there's enough

traffic on the site where you know

making the tweaks that you're talking

about and actually you know pulling on a

CRO tool that can do a/b tests where we

get you know incremental you know 1% you

know maybe the ten dollars you mentioned

was significant in one direction or

another and then you know you get the

compound effect is like these 1%

increases and like I said the site's

making enough to where these 1%

increases are like you know can be

thousands of dollars each month yeah

so you also need to consider like

context yep yeah so I with my shading so

I I did these tests

to the top three pages which were laid

the top three in terms of traffic and

they were positive so then I rolled out

the same changes to the top ten posts

then I added a bunch more posts and did

link building and reinvested at the new

profit I had and then later I noticed I

had a different bunch of posts that were

in my top 10 because rankings are

changed so I did their labor ranges to

them then I started rolling it out to

any posts that got more than 200 visits

a month and then over the course of

about eight months the site went from

yeah like five hundred dollars a month

two thousand in December so what that

was just a case of and I think I only

added about five extra posts so it was

just a case of saying ok this works now

I'm gonna scale it with the rest called

any new because it's the same niche that

it should hold up for your site yeah but

I see a lot of people that they say oh I

just like changed four hundred posts on

my site and and I'm hoping I'll see some

results and I just think you know it

doesn't just change to the top 70% of

traffic and then worry about the other

ninety posts so that's my advice for

that exactly and I mean you know

thinking of 80/20 rule Pareto's ratio

you know I mean just work on the top

view post I mean maybe you just have to

do five of them and you get 80% of the

results and save yourself you know many

hours of headache going through making

those changes yeah exactly and then if

you're only testing two posts you get to

run a lot more tests as well because if

something doesn't work you can just try

something else

and then you're gonna find what does

work okay so we're we know how you use

keywords in your content we know what

kind of publishing schedule you do and

kind of how you approach CRO and

formatting and stuff you mentioned your

editor puts a YouTube video in is that

every post or do you just kind of throw

it in sometimes pretty much every post

if for some reason there's not anything

related we'll skip it but you know

usually a few images in a YouTube video

to the topic so that's just for like

making your content have more rich media

and stuff yep exactly

okay so how do you track what's working

do you track every single keyword in a

keyword tracking tool right yeah

fairly sloppy you know I'm a little lazy

as well and when you start talking about

like the sheer number of you know the

posts that I was doing

yeah the tracking sloppy so I track all

of the keywords and I guess it's like

sir pleb code at UK is that the is that

the tool so yeah okay so that you know I

feel like it's one of the more

economical tools it does the job that I

needed to do I pay for a couple extra

BOTS and it's only ten bucks a month or

something so I can track hundreds of

keywords and it's no no problem so I'll

you know take a look and you know at

this point I can just see like little

fluctuations you know sometimes a

particular page or term will go up or

down just a bit but at this point you

know most all of these are like ranking

in the top ten somewhere and I could

track it that way additionally you know

at the end of the day right the rankings

are important but even more important is

the revenue so what I did at the very

beginning this whole project was created

a tracking ID just for these kgr terms

right so I have a tracking ID that it's

used only in kg are compliant posts that

way I could easily see that I'd have to

do some math but it's roughly like 40%

of the revenue is from kgr posts with no

backlinks to them and then about 60% is

you know sort of like the bigger more

competitive keywords so in short like

the tracking I do is sir plot just to

you know make sure these particular

pages they view I could do a little bit

of analysis to make sure the pages are

ranking for the terms in which I want

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