Facebook NEVER learns - WAN Show April 12, 2019 #Helpful Post

welcome to the land show it's on time

weird isn't it it's crazy it's like

someone isn't here we've got some pretty

interesting topics this week valve to

address review bombing in new update to

user review systems interesting also

even potentially more interesting

Facebook patent to use user adds user

photos as ads hmm also Amazon workers

may be listening to you through your

echo device

all this and more roll the intro Wow

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see this plate yes well we'll get to

that but first valve addressing review

bombing you see this pretty often

actually review bombing that is yeah

tell us about it

so like a new game will come up

especially for smaller games where like

a hundred two hundred reviews is gonna

be a very significant portion of the

reviews on the platform you will see

Brigade Inge

we're like a group of people decide that

they don't like or that they do like

I've actually I believe review bombing

has happened in the other direction as

well it's something it's probably more

more common on like we knew but it's

basically up voting it let's get this to

the front page yeah yeah yeah just just

like how on Amazon people can buy

positive reviews I don't necessarily

know if this stuff is purchased but

you'll get a group of people that

whether they've really played a game or

not they've like one minute on record a

practice thing ever very positive review

yeah I think I think it goes in in both

directions and the ways that valve wants

to address this I think are pretty

interesting this is driving me nuts

there's these headphones that are

plugged in right now and everything we

say is coming out of it all and I can

just vaguely to hear it on the side when

you're review bombing happens yeah it's

not usually when the game comes out or

is it sometimes just rattling like five

years later yeah it can happen way later

down the line too

one of the interesting ones it's like a

patch will come out more an expansion or

something and then it'll get tanked at

that point in time and on Steam you can

see all-time and recent so if you're

viewing a game in like the all-time is

very positive but the recent is like

very negative that's pretty bad as well

so it can take a surprisingly low amount

of reviews to really sway people's

perceptions because if you have enough

people to slam a game that's decently

old but you can make the recent go to

very positive or very

or whatever way you want to push it you

can really affect people's decisions on

things so where are those brigades

organized so usually happen on the

subreddit for the game or escort or

gaming subreddits gaming disk right

there's a bunch of different ways I

think there's also a little bit where

like this is almost more of a mentality

thing I think there's two so I think

there's two other things around to is is

one if you're like I'm not really sure

and then you see the game and it has

mixed reviews you'll probably go yeah

and give it a mixed review you're like

yeah I'm not really sure but everyone

else is reading it very positive you

might go like it was pretty all right

well I think there's some that happens

where it's just things are swayed but

another problem that they're going after

is something that I saw on and this

actually pissed me off I saw this on a

local review of mucho burrito recently

okay

some guy rated at one star because he

ordered some mucho burrito from skip the

dishes and the like delivery was late or

something ah that's that's a completely

unrelated thing and one of the ways that

valve wants to address this is to this

is actually exactly what they're talking

about yeah with this new announcement

want to deal with off topic review right

so let's just like to introduce it in

terms of the article yeah

so in an effort to keep games review

scores which is something we didn't talk

about yet is not only are people leaving

reviews but the reviews they leave are

contributing to an overall review score

and in an effort to keep the game's

review scores as a meaningful indicator

for whether or not someone should buy

the game valve is now rolling out a new

review system for steam that detects

off-topic review bombing and removes the

impact of these reviews from the games

review store important distinction there

they are not removing the reviews the

reviews are staying on there you can

still read all yeah they're just

removing the contribution of those

reviews to the overall score it's not

fair

let's say there's a lot of the off topic

DRM things are like or about DRM yeah

yeah

or is this in steams estimation here

they have a little criteria I do

that should affect it personally but

well this is the meat of this topic it's

the gray area so we've already defined

for you what a review bomb is now let's

talk about what an off topic review bomb

is Steam says when the focus of those

reviews is on a topic that valve

considers unrelated to the likelihood

that future purchasers will be happy if

they buy the game and hence not

something that should be added to the

review score okay yeah see cuz like if

we if we pull this away from gaming

temporarily if you want to review

something on like Rotten Tomatoes and

you went to go review hellboy which is

currently 11 out of 100 and you were

like thinking about it in both sides if

you want to rate a movie a zero or just

don't do it because it's Rotten Tomatoes

because you went to the theater and the

popcorn sucked yeah that would be really

stupid just like the skip the dish's

thing yeah if you wanted to review

Hellboy as definitely go watch it

because the popcorn was great that's

equally stupid so like I I'd like the

getting rid of off-topic things I am

going to be very interested in what they

deem as off-topic because the DRM thing

is extremely on topic in my opinion so

on their announcement blog there's a

section at the bottom underneath where

they outline what they're doing they

have a Q&A; section and DRM is actually

specifically called out there and the Q

part is I care about some things that I

worry other players don't like DRM or

EULA changes review bombs have new the

changes are also super important review

bombs have been about them in the past

you consider them unrelated or off topic

and the answer is we have long it long

debates about these two and others like

them they're testing technically not

part of the game but they are an issue

for some players in the end we decided

to define them as off-topic because the

general Steam player doesn't care as

much about them

so the review score is more accurate if

it doesn't contain them in addition we

believe that players who do care about

topics like DRM are often willing to dig

a little deeper into games before

purchasing which is why we still keep

all

reviews within the review bumps it only

takes a minute to dig into those reviews

to see if the issue is something you

carry no one's gonna do well you they

they're saying that the fair enough I

just said that's really annoying to me

because games like I don't even know if

this was on Steam to be completely

honest but then newer Assassin's Creed

games origins I believe specifically had

a de nouveaux or something I think it

had like three different layers of DRM

and it was crippling I I did a stream of

that game when it first came out and ran

my like CPU usage statistics the entire

time I was playing and would like go

into different areas and look at things

it's about benchmarking it cuz I was

like holy crap this thing is thrashing

me way harder than it should be and it

was really interesting to to test that

doesn't mean it's a good game for people

because the system's getting thrashed

and I found it interesting it does not

mean it's good for the general person

but I do think a lot of people should

know because it's genuinely really hard

for people to run if they didn't have

yeah a decent enough so maybe don't buy

it

yeah so it's true and that even don't

buy the damn game and then there's

there's been was it a Kerbal space

program or something had a really weird

EULA update that made it so that like

yeah you probably shouldn't buy this

game oh wow I don't I don't I could be

super inflammatory saying Kerbal space

program

now I must know you list by EULA and

user License Agreement guys curl space

programs new EULA makes it spyware take

two is not quite the headline yeah I

don't know very much about this to be

completely clear and I think it's gonna

take quite a bit to dive into but my

stance is just going to be that you the

updates are very important okay and and

DRM stuff can be very important I think

I think people review bombing every

single every single game that comes out

that has DRM on it is like maybe a

little excessive but when people are

like the DRM implementation in this game

is ridiculous and extremely detrimental

and we should probably all get very

angry about this I think that's very

valid well luckily for people like you

and pose who share your opinion

you can completely opt out of this

entirely opt out so there's gonna be a

checkbox in I think it's there now there

is now a checkbox in your steam store

options where you can choose to have

off-topic review BOM still included in

all the review scores you see sweet cool

thank you for the option yeah sounds

good so we have a little bit more

information about how they're doing this

with their processes basically they made

some kind of a automated tool that looks

at the frequency of reviews so let's say

a game came out it's been out for two

years and suddenly it gets a huge number

of reviews it'll get flagged and that's

all the tool does the tool doesn't try

to figure out why or at all all it does

is say hey look at this anomalous

activity and then a team of humans will

then look at it okay and then these

people have already been trained at

looking at review bombs in the past or

off bombs in the past yeah so they can

determine I mean because there's review

bombs that are normal you know like a

lot of reviews because the game came out

today and yeah and we all love it yeah

all want everyone to buy read dead or

something

risk of rain to this dream was a claim

that had like almost no marketing and

then got positively review bummed if you

want to call it that because tons of

people that played it thought it was

amazing and then it sold really well it

was great here's another little wrinkle

when they determined that this a period

of time represents an off-topic review

bomb they don't have much sensitivity in

saying which are gonna stay in which are

gonna be deemed bad so it's like okay

this weekend this two-day period there's

people like you were getting review

bombed we're gonna remove all of those

reviews from contributing toward reviews

for well even if you just legitimately

happen to review that day and it was a

genuine review that's not about DRM or

EULA or something that they think is off

topic your your reviews gonna get this

kind of super bad my opinion yes it is

but I think it's a drop in the bucket

for the overall score but that's not

because that nullifies major

not really because then if so that

nullifies major EULA and DRM and

whatever else they decide is off topic

changes from being noticed by the

general public because most people are

not going to I will most people are not

going to go into their settings and make

it so that this thing doesn't apply to

them and most people if the crit let's

assume the Kerbal space program thing is

real I don't know I never looked into it

too deeply I just shared it to one of my

friends that plays the game and I don't

know but let's assume that it's spyware

now I don't know I probably

hypothetically I would want to know that

that EULA is technically unrelated or

whatever they called it so the recent

reviews would still show up as very

positive I believe because I believe

that's what curls space program is but

the recent reviews when that came out

made it very negative the score would be

positive the rear the written reviews

would still be negative yeah yeah but

most people aren't gonna scroll through

the reviews they're just gonna go oh all

time very positive a recent very

positive sounds good game looks

interesting let's go oh I think you just

understand what I'm saying mmm what I'm

saying is let's say everyone goes and

bombs it yeah and the score is unaltered

because they deemed it off topic what

I'm saying is if there happened to be a

guy who came in and just gave a review

during that same weekend and was like it

doesn't no no I know I know I know so

what I'm saying what that is like it

will nullify any of this news basically

because no yeah I guess cuz that's yeah

I know I guess what I'm saying it's

pretty off all right sounds good

I just I guess no salad yeah I just I

don't like the idea that you're

notifying everything because it will

make any major change that people like

that isn't directly related to game play

because I think that's effectively what

they're saying his only game play things

whatever get mentioned well they're not

explicitly saying that that might be

like de-facto with me yeah I definitely

but it feels like that's what it's gonna

end up being any problem that is ever

unrelated to game play I'm assuming at

this point it's just gonna disappear

so you're saying by saying that I think

you're indicating that the score is very

that's the main thing you look at as a

scheme user I would assume it's the main

thing that a lot of people look at

because it's the main thing that's

projected you when you go to a game on

the store let's let's try this out let's

look at risk of rain that's actually the

forecast for this week on Saturday okay

let's go to my screen risk of rain - it

doesn't have a recent because the game

just freakin came out so it makes sense

all reviews overwhelmingly positive

10,000 reviews I don't think most people

are gonna click on this they're just

gonna see overwhelmingly positive and go

great this game this video that's

auto-playing

looks interesting it's overwhelmingly

positive maybe scroll down and like you

to get through just upload my friends

play it whatever I think you have to go

pretty far recent updates about the game

key features system requirements more

like this what creators say or views

down here I don't think most people are

reading reviews right there they're

super buried I think you can get shuffle

sweet strawpoll this is going to be so

before we do this drop I'm gonna say

this is gonna be one of the more skewed

straw polls that we have because we're

gonna have a whole bunch of power users

what if it says a whole bunch of power

users are not reading reviews I'm

pushing back on that cuz I don't see

people to be a power user to read

reviews because I think we have such an

e-commerce culture now I always read the

views on Amazon I'm used to scrolling

all the way to the bottom of an Amazon

page to get to the reviews that's a good

point because usually I read all the

negative reviews on Amazon or I'll read

the run to one stars like you're making

a purchasing decision here I'm gonna

read a couple read the top you know top

positive top negative yeah that's see in

a straw poll I think you're right on

that one okay

do you read steam in all capitals before

when you're when you're interested in

buying like before you buy do you read a

couple reviews or do you just use the

overall score yeah I'm doing like a

little side test thing as I'm interested

so we're doing yes no and no but I do on

Amazon because that's my SATs you and

I'm wondering

if I'm weird or if that's your

definitely weird yeah but like I wonder

how much because did do you read reviews

for games on Steam well like if you've

already heard of a game and that's why

you're there then you don't really need

to read the reviews but that's that's

kind of what I'm talking really depends

on how many people are just browsing

when they're like I want to buy a game

and I'm just gonna browse the store and

just find something it seems like

usually it's word-of-mouth like people

you know who you game with or playing

that kind of game I browse quite a bit

sometimes you do word of mouth if I get

word of mouth about a product that's on

Amazon though I still very often read

the reviews if I get word of mouth what

a game on Steam I'll check the positive

negative thing because I want to know if

something recent did something bad to it

mmm because someone might have played a

game like Kerbal space program for

example hypothetically so I might have

played it and enjoyed it for like a year

and then this EULA thing comes out I

don't want to spyware a game so they

don't necessarily know that because

they've just been playing they're not

checking the store page there's one play

again so that I would be nice for me to

know and I just do a little quick check

and then move on

I wonder I'd like to see the stats on

how many people straight-up opted out of

this yes that would be really put that

in your next hardware survey even though

it's not Hardware tuck it in there how

long do we have to wait before we can

look at this poll I want to post it in

the YouTube chat really quick I'm trying

to get there do oh there's so many

interesting questions how do people get

new games because you're right like a

lot there's especially in the indie

space there's so many games that don't

have a lot of marketing but then you get

the buzz in other ways like apex legends

obviously they had influence or

marketing but then they do they had

millions of dollars in influencer

marketing yeah but a lot of people heard

about it from other people getting a

popular like I heard about it like on a

Monday when it was like over the weekend

two million people started playing this

game but that I think was a lot of

influencer marketing and then people

seen the influencers and then friends

telling each other

it just wasn't spammed and

here wait let's see okay results do you

know if a game is like has a weird did

that fix it hello did I fix it we're

having a text bill difficulty here

this should be good now is it okay well

we're good now okay it was twitch over

here only we were getting a nap it

didn't happen last time which is weird

but I ran my laptop minimum oh it's

night are you sure it's black magic you

take the other cards out well then I

don't know I think that's time to move

to the next topic here but yeah it

shouldn't take audio from there anyways

yeah let's move on Facebook patent thank

you for playing chat for letting me know

that was going on a new Facebook patent

reals that favorite is even more out of

touch than you could have ever had oh my

god

there's like you read us written so

basically what what's going on here is

there gonna have an AI thingamajig wait

hold on it's a patent so first of all

that's fair they're thinking about it

they patent it that doesn't mean they'll

ever become a product it's not a product

right now they're not doing it right now

yeah that's a good that's a very good

point but the idea is they could look

through profile photos on Facebook and

look for photos where someone is

prominently holding a product like a

coke can or a Doritos bad burritos bag

or whatever else where you can clearly

see the product and then they would be

able to use those photos they real

license those photos not to you by the

way but there would be the license of

those photos for ads on Facebook so they

would I they would use machine learning

algorithms to identify these photos I

think they already do have which would

probably not be that hard because you

just look for a logo and then they'll

train with certain domains first like I

can like snacks and stuff seems pretty

easy to start with clothing would be way

harder they'll do that later yeah but

they'll recognize these photos will

identify them and then they'll they'll

pitch certain clients like hey coca-cola

here's a bunch of photos of people

holding your product coca-cola would

then use those photos as ads that and

here's where I'm not clear would an ad

of me holding a coke can

go only to me and my friends or were to

go to the whole Facebook Network what we

have written here is from the article

did to do the patent filing suggests

that the adverts would only be targeted

to a persons Facebook friends if the

user had limited their private privacy

settings that way that that language

from that article anyway suggests that

the default would be that it goes to

everybody if your if your privacy

settings are public yeah I think it

would go to everybody I don't think I

don't really think that makes any sense

I don't think they would do that it does

make sense but if they found a

particularly good one like a fairly

professional photo yeah babe yeah they

might yeah I don't know seems weird that

I actually do see the business sense as

creepy as it is and how we're all mad

right now I could see why they would

pitch this as a product yeah I mean

colds completely blind to civilization

business man I completely get it as well

because you're showing someone their

friends that's cool consuming or using a

product that's what advertising it has

always been like associating the brown

with something you like and you're

likely forcing word-of-mouth this the

safe bet was always like okay use George

Clooney use someone we all like but now

because it's so personal there's this

walk hey I happen to know you're friends

with this person how about I just show

you them or even yourself like hey

remember a year ago and you had all that

fun eating those cheesie's get cheese

again man that was a good night I really

hope that this goes poorly and there's

like someone doing something bad with

the product this is exactly what I think

like oh look at real someone drinking

Grey Goose

that's my alcoholic friend yeah that

guy's not okay he's in rehab

yeah totally shoot yourself in the foot

how are they gonna know there's no way

for them to know I really yeah I really

really hope that if this does get put in

place which I hope it doesn't but if it

does I really hope it'd go sideways in

like glorious ways I don't see how they

could ever really implement this because

the the optics are so bad and then

that's obvious that's an obvious

downside

could easily happen easily happen or

like like you see the amount of times

that like what was that Microsoft ai

that people like made racist oh yeah

yeah is it like learn I'm from winner

people and then they like pushed it yeah

yeah so like people people love messing

with this kind of stuff yeah I'll just

upload pictures of me holding Doritos

bag and like oh yeah by my crotch yeah

that won't affect you though because

remember Facebook identifies it with

algorithmically and then hands it to and

so people are gonna see it so you can't

just roll like that unless it's a brand

that likes that if it's like a weird ran

like a deer and or something and I'm

wearing only deer and they might

actually like that bread would be like

yeah you're hilarious into whether or

not remember a few years ago this is

actually a few years ago like back when

I was in university maybe almost a

decade ago there was a stuff going

around that was like did you know that

you don't own your photos yes book

Facebook owns your photos yeah so I

looked into it and at least some this I

believe this is sourced to here an

article from 2017 said you know you in

fact do own your photos you own them and

if you take them away Facebook can't use

them anymore but they can use the mother

on the platform right correct when

they're on the platform Facebook has

total license to do stuff with them

including sub-licensing them to say

Pepsi Cola or whatever so start deleting

the ones you don't all the times you

were photographed holding Doritos or

something just delete them if you don't

want this to happen yeah yeah or just

stop really using Facebook delete

Facebook nice heck yeah it's useful in

other ways basically the only reason why

I have it is getting in contact with

people that are sometimes very hard to

get in contact with those phone books

aren't like really a thing anymore

yeah Facebook's the Yellow Pages yep

it's really good for those weak ties

yeah I don't have you're never really

friends I've met you you're useful now

yeah I want to get in touch here's a

message I'm speaking of are we at

halftime

should we are we you we are pretty much

we can do the thing I don't know what

I'm leaning back to do square face let's

do that

I'll also lean back partway through I

was just like where am I going I'd have

no idea

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yeah I think you have a sign up for a

year because buying domain generally

lasts for a minimum of a year at a time

so that makes sense but yeah moving

onwards we have disparate display

display right here this one guess what

this plate is a magnet mounted metal

print pull it over there we'll see you

later good bye and then you could be

like no Vancouver is upside down well

the upside down what do you think about

that it's abstract or utilities need to

bludgeon they're durable as you probably

just saw you don't need any power tools

to hang it with clearly which is cool

there's over 260,000 different arts

spanning a bunch of different styles and

influences with their easy metal with

their easy magnet mounting there are no

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I'm really trying to serve the OCD

people out there that's gonna bother

bowling yeah yeah probably me speaking

of that though if you were going to in

get originally like that unlike a lot of

things you can just turn it back I'm

gonna try to also do a good job good

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can make sure it's correct after the

fact which is pretty cool they also

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heck yeah and PR we got a new domain

thing which is cool LM GD g / p i a wham

instead of the crazy long things go on

the LI pyaar wan that sounds like an

island in the Philippines that'd be cool

it was private Internet access supports

a variety of VPN protocols and types of

encryption and authentication allowing

you to dial in the exact level of

privacy protection you need which is

cool but it has apps for Windows Mac OS

Android iOS it still says Linus

but Linux Google Chrome and support for

several other platforms coming soon you

connect up to five devices at the same

time apps include DNS leak protection

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switch will block all traffic if the VPN

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don't have to worry about a security

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faulty for a second no data will go

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it out today at LMG comm /p ia Wang or

Pia wand PL Wan Jia Wan yeah

the emphasis matters whether you're

talking with the the island or the

people that live there this is a very

niche Philippines joke here Amazon

speaking of not niche I don't know

Amazon workers are listening in on Echo

audio report says oh people are mad and

I don't know why GG heck yeah

get out here Jamie you should have a

better domain we're past that stage

we're talking about Amazon now yeah

apparently it's LG chichi and I said

calm sorry about that

see my website is cool in Hazzard calm

the falkland are calm cool subscribe

heck yeah anyways Amazon workers are

listening to what you tell Alexa what

did you say you're wondering why people

are mad yeah well let's talk about it

yeah

bloomberg reports okay first of all

Bloomberg lately I think they've eroded

their trust

everybody's been way more off the board

the Bloomberg in my opinion Forbes oh I

don't know I'm just read stuff I'm not

talking about weird topics I'm talking

about trust because it started with that

report they made about the sorry Forbes

said the Chinese like microchip yeah a

lot weird a lot of people were like I

don't know doesn't sound credible and

then from there oh they had a recent one

and now this anyway no incredible they

just do weird stuff now the bloomberg

reports amazon tasks outside contractors

as well as full-time Amazon and

employees to comb through snippets of

audio from echo devices to help train a

le XA the company's voice enabled

assistant the clips include both

explicit commands and background

conversations presumably background

conversations that are caught happening

you say the hot word probably kind of

whatever whenever yeah what why not what

do you mean why not there's there's

nothing that stops them from doing it

whatever well it's not supposed to

connect to the servers and tell you say

the hot word sure I'm sure they could do

it absolutely whatever and they're

trying to train it to be better right so

they could be trying to train it to pick

up the thing is I don't think they have

to

I don't think okay hey I hear you're

saying they're like what if someone says

the hot word but then they want to hear

ten seconds before that to see if it

took that person twenty tries and then

they can learn okay you're Scottish and

this is how you say it

or if someone who is trying to say it

and failed and guess what I'm saying and

then just little tinfoil hat yeah I

think they don't I don't know I think

they could there's so many commands

every day

but you could go with false matches that

are fairly high percentage yeah like I

think you might have tried but it wasn't

good enough for them to actually

activate they could still listen to

those periods of time but how they

wouldn't be able to identify those

because it's only gonna connect the

service that only record when you

actually did make a match is that a harm

is that true are you sure it only

records when you fully make a match yeah

like if you say like hi Boogle then it's

it's it's like nope like I have my

Google home set to go drink after I say

it yeah and there are times where I'm

watching a movie and someone just says

something totally um they'll say like

yes please but they say no way that

sounds like the hot word and it'll be

dink when I'm just watching a movie I

know I probably not right now someone

hits like hi Boogle I know probably not

right now but for quite a while there

the biggest concern was it not detecting

when people were trying mm-hmm so I

would expect them to try to find the

ways that people were towards the audio

but it doesn't do a command yeah it

could happen like I'm not saying they're

gonna I'm not they record every single

word and he whatever says anywhere near

them and they might but I kind of don't

but from an engineer perspective it's

like a lot of these are the weak points

yeah and you would want to learn how to

improve that yeah so I could definitely

see them passing through recorded audio

and being like what was this was this

supposed to be an accurate match was did

our system rate it may be a little too

highly mm-hmm was it someone on a TV

show saying something completely

unrelated another related issue to that

was I mean we haven't really even

explained the whole story yet you get it

though there's they want to train this

machine to do a better job and surprise

they're using humans to do that you

thought maybe they were just putting

more computers on it but obviously

humans are really good at speaking so if

you want to train this thing to speak

better you just take the snippets that

are you're giving the Machine and let

humans annotate to tell the Machine how

to do it better it's pretty obvious

they're using humans but I guess no one

has I never explicitly said they were

doing that on their website it says that

user requests are applied to train our

speech recognition and natural language

understanding systems

it doesn't say with humans but it also

doesn't not say that so I think if you

think about it for a bit you would

assume that there you know yeah no I'm

not surprised at all I and I always

thought they work I do and it's not just

Amazon they're all doing this yeah Apple

does this Google does I'm very surprised

this was news because how else use yeah

of course that's yeah it's pretty weird

I I think one thing that does concern me

is like do they sell this data because

there's so the super unrelated and this

might I don't really use these devices

too often so I don't know but I have one

but I just it's right by my computer so

I usually just end up using a browser

anyways I don't know whatever but like

do outside apps have listen I guess but

like read access to these files

effectively I don't like could an app

that ties in to your echo get read

access to your voice to try to figure

out its side of things better I don't

think so probably not no I don't think

so I think it but like that so my

reference for the this is very shot in

the dark thing yeah I totally I'm not

surprised you say I don't think so but

my reference for that is Gmail thing

that happened forever ago were

personally reading those emails and

there was apparently accounts of people

like finding funny videos and emails and

sharing it to each other for laughs and

stuff so first of all it would be this

is pretty unrelated this would be text

right because it's gonna go right and be

transcribed as text and then you they

wouldn't even get the raw text I

wouldn't think because I would think

they wouldn't get that raw text because

Google would have to say Oh

undetermined oh this text is relevant to

that third party and then hand that

command over so they probably do get the

text but I don't think we almost

certainly don't get I don't think they

even get the raw text I think they get

the determination of what that text was

because and there are some commands you

have to issue on random TVs I've seen

this where you have to be high Boogle

ask

third party to do this like hi Google

asked LG to turn off the lights okay and

then that's this like maybe in that case

cuz you're explicitly saying ask LG then

LG would get the full thing I don't know

no I'm not sure how these interactions

work well one point I wanted to make was

you would think intuitively that when

they're listening to these these voice

clips that there would be a random

sample a big swath from all the users

but maybe it's not maybe there's some

users out there listening to more like

maybe maybe if you have a Scottish

accent or an accident that has

conventionally been very difficult for

the you're like oh that guy's great

we're gonna train on that guy I mean

there's overfitting problems and machine

learning if you if you only use a few

examples like that but they it might be

a subset of the population that's

getting listening to more often yeah

good aspect it would be if you have like

a super generic voice for an area that

has a very high population it's less

likely that I guess yours would be used

for sampling super often yeah or if

you're if they're trying to break into a

new market and there are they you know

that they suck at that market the

forefront of technology in that area

like well we only have ten people from

Glasgow we're gonna use all of them yeah

a lot yeah but there's some other

interesting things in this story the big

question everyone's mind right now is

probably like hey when they're listening

this voice clip of me do they know it's

me in the case of Amazon it appears that

they know your first name

and like out there's a product serial

number or something but they don't have

your last name or other any other

identifying things in the case of Apple

I think they have less than that they

don't have your first name and they have

a randomly generated number to us

associate to your account so it's pretty

safe that's said the clip can contain

sensitive information I'm talking about

my friends full name I could be talking

about my bank stuff I could say my I

looked into my own this was years ago

it's probably better at detection now

but I looked into my own like hey Google

information that probably worked

actually I say it's what you say hi

that's why I said hi anyway my bad but I

looked into like all the different audio

snip recording things the amount of

times that I was in the car and just

like an audiobook or the radio was on

we're definitely no one said that and it

has a recording of that is sing well the

amount of recordings there are of me not

trying to interact with it is wild Wow

like many hundred well you know how do

you know for sure that definitely no one

said that because I believe that after

the hot word then there's a delay and

then the recording so the audio so I

would be silent in the car but the audio

book could have said it like a second

before they're like Star Wars audiobooks

generally you would be surprised that

like I said mine's beside my couch and I

can hear it when it gets activated and

you'd be surprised sometimes what

activates it I'd be like I'm sure

there's a sound that sounded something

like whatever mm-hmm maybe some alien

has a weird name in Star Wars but like

the amount of times what all I was

saying is unintentional stuff that ends

up in there yeah and you're saying like

personal information obviously Star Wars

doesn't count for that but there was a

lot of other recordings as well

where is just like a random I can barely

even remember the conversation but it's

clearly a random conversation between me

and a friend and we're clearly not

trying to interact I see a lot of what

happens to me is I'll have people over

like a dinner party or something

I'll interact with it to change the song

and then I know I can just kind of turn

away and keep talking and I know that

the Machine will will know that what I'm

talking about now isn't relevant so even

though it wasn't even though the light's

still blinking it'll be like yeah and I

can just keep having my conversation but

that's gonna be recorded yeah just give

me an extra eight seconds of me talking

about tacos yeah I don't know this is

the kind of stuff we're like a lot of a

lot of modern technologies in various

ways you give up certain privacy's or

securities to have those technologies

and this is one of them if you want to

have a smart speaker in your home just

understand this stuff and move forward

you you're carrying about your security

is very important it's probably fine

though assault they were told

eventually that Amazon it was not

Amazon's responsibility to take action

so you know they go to their manager you

guys someone at the company has the

means to find out who this is like

should we tell the authorities and say

you know like someone got beaten up here

like they should get a record or

something like that what are the big

problems with this is

just like a roleplay BDSM etc etc etc

we're like it could be totally

aboveboard mm-hmm and now there's the

police knocking on your door because you

have AI helper robot thing yeah and you

never authorized maybe it's a movie yeah

totally appreciate the idea of reducing

those types of things but the Minority

Report also freaks me the hell out

mm-hmm and there's a lot of stuff that

could make someone think that that are

okay yeah yeah yeah it's not it is not

their responsibility that distri with

Amazon's can be used as evidence but I

think that's whether you think that's

okay or not that is definitely a totally

different thing they're not being

proactive they're reacting to law

enforcement like it's whether you think

it's okay or not I think they're in

totally different oh yeah

super chats super chats let's go they're

like normal chats but super bunch of

people sending $1.00 with no text I

appreciate it very nice appreciate you

um someone's asking you about some lag

on flow plane I think we know what's

going on there but it seems like it did

go pretty well today every week it's

improving a little bit I like the

pictures you guys have on the wall cool

go to full plate and bye Luke a better

office heck yeah I like my office right

now but we do have to move because LG's

expanding so darn fast guys gonna move

eventually cuz he is gonna be out of

space yeah like actually good god yeah

the rate at which LG is hiring is just

wild and floatplane tiring too and I'm

trying to bring people in locally like

there's there's one will is moving here

very soon oh one of the new hires that

we have is a Canadian he'll be moving

here locally so like within the next six

months we'll probably have two more

people locally yeah and there's other

people moving in locally that's all it

takes

honestly that like we're already

oversized at that point if between the

two companies there are six more people

it'd be over done yeah and that's gonna

happen really soon yeah so like I'm

active

looking for other places it's gonna be

really weird but oh well are you still

gonna come over for Friday wins at these

sweet a few guys are just in this

complex or something they'll be pretty

so I wanted that too but realistically

these are all things I'm suited for that

really yeah we just need an office space

yeah so it's like probably go downtown

be one of those like exposed brick posh

concrete super expensive yeah your

startup though baby get that investor

cash there's a yeah just reading about

people in our space don't even

necessarily competitors but in our space

that are like oh yeah they've got like

twenty to forty million dollars in VC

fund I'm like oh oh geez

yeah people talking about the audio

apparently the focus was screwed up like

the whole show the focus is for like the

back of our chairs so when when you and

I are leaning forward we're like super

oh so that sucks do they know he was

away and then his plane came in late I

believe oh I didn't know that I don't

think he was planning to come ever

though probably not I was like he was in

England yeah so his time shift is gonna

be smaller yeah I dare you guys to eat

the Carolina Reaper savage jerky I don't

think they're response to this week so

you don't have any here but we've done

it before on my very first one I did

that oh damn

Alexa in Google home do save recordings

where nothing happens I just researched

this and tested for a class project

send us your paper bro yeah let me just

do it up email me your thesis Luke from

one broadcast dye your hair green oh I

think greens obvious hair color and love

from actually depends on the green I

think it can be definitely it can be

yeah anyways that's it for super chats

I believe we're wait are we done no we

have one more topic yeah there's one

more oh I see what people are talking

about sorry about that

there you go what is the one more

Walmart adding more robots Walmart

already employs many robots they're

getting lots more they have announced

they will deploy 1500

new Auto C autonomous floor cleaners you

know like those floor clean of things

that people ride on like me and that

kind of like little Zamboni's I think

they don't need those anymore

mmm but 1500 how many swall marks

locations are there if it's not very

many in them in the grand scheme of

Walmart like here okay well mites are

large though I'm gonna make a guess how

many Walmart locations are this 50

states they're in multiple countries I'm

gonna say 3,000 4,700 that's actually I

guess it's more than you thought I was

guessing around 6 K so I do you think

that they're gonna get one floor cleaner

per store like even in their test the

subset of stores that are testing this

do you think they're getting more than

yeah I know I think they just get one

just one okay because if it's automated

it can cruise around and do whatever all

night yeah yeah yeah so Walmart is

getting 1500 Auto C autonomous for Fears

they're getting only 300 Auto s shelf

scanners what does that thing do

probably just check inventory how I'm

picturing like those like surveillance

drones and Star Wars that are like those

balls all the antennas like just

hovering down the aisles just gonna ride

along the ledge of the shelf you think

it's I don't know I don't know I'm

really not sure they're getting an

additional 1200 fast unloaders to scan

and sort items as they come off delivery

trucks this one's interesting plus to

streamline online orders it will have

900 pickup towers so customers can order

something on the company's site and pick

it up from a vending machine at the

nearest Walmart pick oh that's less

interesting though I thought because

like building towers across the country

I just like this is getting very pretty

it's just a it's just yeah and it's at a

Walmart locations where there's anything

not that interesting and just buy from

the store yeah the idea is that by

pushing menial tasks to the robots

Walmart's human employees can spend more

time helping customers in preparing

online orders for pickup that is sweet

bullcrap yes let us fire them

they'll replace them eventually yeah but

it is my job while they're unsure in the

meantime it's like hey you don't have to

do this anymore so you can just help

people which is cool

we got a few years of awesome and then a

lot less people have jobs it sucks when

you're walking around a store and you're

like who works here and then you see

someone works there and they're doing

something and you're like hey can i bug

you and they're like I guess one thing

I've always wanted especially at Home

Depot is like and home people has an app

and that I believe it's supposed to do

this but last time I tried it it sucked

but maybe it's gotten better because

I've been trying forever but I want to

be able to be on my phone in the store

and just like where the heck is this

thing and have it tell me turn left

because that's pretty much the only

reason why I ever need your employees

yeah for sure where the heck is this

like the last thing I needed was like a

shelf peg it's like weird where would

that be

mmm a shelf peg yeah like and then like

like the little like clear plastic

little l-shaped thing that you put in

the hole on the shelf to hold the

individual like a bracket like like that

you put shut it no no no but they're

like super tiny Oh like this big it has

a little metal nub it and there's a hole

drill that you know love it love it

I don't know what to call it okay I

wouldn't know where to buy that either

dude right hates hardware and Canadian

Tire has it aisle and she'll fix that's

cool that's sweet but like do you have

to install an app and so I just said

there's nobody equities would even noob

its world's best stable digital

currencies nub it to bees baby and you

be vit

what does another dude Urban Dictionary

nub it oh geez

it's a word now yeah someone make a new

entry yeah there we go

an of it make it not the one that's on

there it's like a nubbin no just their

site okay that's cool be able to use

apparently Canadian Tire website to look

for an item I'll let you know where it

is

oh they're like but how do they let you

know they say oh thanks I owe an IO and

shelf that's pretty good

yeah can I just say I would like to have

a beep I'd like to have a warmer colder

is an alien

yeah they're really close to us I think

so I think that's our original alien

stuff yeah I don't think that's predator

so yeah I think so

but I like one thing that I think is

pretty important too though is that it

needs to be able to be pretty good at

guessing what the heck you're talking

about

yeah because especially in a place like

like Home Depot or Lowe's or whatever

where it's like Hardware you matter

people are gonna go in there and be like

I need a screw it's like what screw it's

like it uh this one I don't know that it

would be cool if you can take a picture

or something like well you bought is

even remotely close to what you search

they'd be like what do you meant by Nava

to learn what the heck knowbut is over

time shelf no that's heck yeah I I I

called them it's the reason why I'm like

particularly triggered about this shelf

peg thing is because I it took me I

think four or five employees to find it

oh yeah

because I'd asked one and they'd send me

somewhere to get in there and be like

this is planks of wood this is not

plastic things with little metal things

coming out of them they just they didn't

accompany you they just sent you in see

you later

but like honestly they're so freaking

busy each one of them were helping like

three or four people they can move I

think they need more a they need more

auto cease and auto asses yeah to help

them

come on Home Depot figure it out but

yeah you're right eventually it'll just

be no one working the check out it'll be

guest service and a couple people

walking around and that's it yeah it's

just an AI it just blows around how are

you doing today hmm and if they have to

you can do live chat you just get

someone up on the screen yeah all right

what do you need how did you get

elevated to this the Nuggets are over

there right why did you press zero five

times come on give me a break it's a

Friday

yeah I don't know I kind of its it I

don't know if I'm naive or just a

butthole but I kind of welcome the if

you a severe endure okay automated

checkout really that's not the direction

I thought you're going yeah like I've

been doing McDonald's once in Australia

and these we use the self menu thing

save someone's job and go up there

and I was like nope I would like to send

the signal that I prefer this I don't

think anyone should work at the front of

this I don't I don't know I think maybe

because how do you want to solve I'm a

techno optimist yeah yeah because I

believe that in the eventual future

where no one's working they're the

people that are working are getting paid

a lot and the people aren't working are

on a beach playing guitar I love this

idea but how do you like fun to those

people corporate taxes corporate taxes

okay I don't have all the answers man

I'm not like know you've all hurry or

whatever but I think whirring one of my

problems there is like you would need

this is going super off-topic and the

show is almost over so we can cut it

pretty quick but like how aggressive are

your allowances for small business then

because there's a lot of industries like

the one flow plane is trying to get into

now that to penetrate properly you're

going to have to get relatively large

yeah like if we had super aggressive

corporate taxes of the people that would

be working at McDonald's and they don't

actually need to do that job because

that should be automated relatively

quickly because we're wasting human

potential can go sit on a beach or make

art or whatever if our corporate taxes

have to pay for that we're screwed

when we have to go up against these

giant companies sure there's other

proposals someone had a proposal about

making robots pay income tax

I think the Economist magazine was like

that's a bad idea I read that article I

don't know why it's a bad idea but I'm

not saying that the tools we have now

are going to be sufficient in that world

I think I I am very strongly in

agreeance that like we're way off topic

here but like the just the the mass

waste of human potential is amazing just

what the lengths people will go to and

and the fact that like someone can be

very good at something but modern hiring

processes have not really gotten much

better in like a really long time so you

have to even if you're in X

extremely skilled person at something

you probably have to go through the

Walmart or McDonald's or whatever grind

so that you can like eventually land a

job somewhere get like the placement of

very skilled people is not very good

yeah specially if you're an immigrant I

have a doctor I'm driving a taxi I like

it and it's taxis that should probably

be automated why we're so close to that

being done the whole transportation

industry is just gonna poof maybe that's

good driving a vehicle is not driving a

vehicle on most situations there are

obviously certain situations where it's

extremely highly skilled but in most

people's day-to-day driving vehicles a

menial task yeah automate that stuff get

people to get rid of it and things but

it's just how do you support those

people anyway it's gonna be short term

hard yeah a short term extremely

difficult for individuals whose lives

matter yeah so let's end the show yeah

thanks for tuning in folks

outro oh geez I didn't set it back there

we go one more plug for display right

here yeah and you're done

when when when some good made an account

another person just made straight up

there's nothing now bits you know that

you're a legend Frodo Frodo hobbits

there's so many no it's the marketing of

it what's happening

I just noticed this little haven't even

of it show heck yeah everybody make the

name something and with neva it will be

our inside joke I'm not inside joke

anymore haha

areas display PIAA Squarespace Chris Bay

we're out of here later