hey what's going on welcome to the Doug
show in this episode I talked to Evan
Porter and this is an update because
I've talked to Evan two other times once
when he hit 4,000 per month and once
when he hit 8,000 per month which are
huge milestone so congratulations Evan
but sadly in this episode we talked
about taking a traffic hit and losing
some traffic due to some algorithm
updates and how evan has handled it but
he's still you know making a full-time
income and doing it pretty well
so he's just taking it in stride but
it's interesting to hear you know the
approach and I mean not all of these
stories are like perfect all the time we
like to think that but they're not
always perfect so number one if you're
new to the channel please have a look at
some of the other videos if you like
what you see subscribe it'll be awesome
it'll be great to have you as part of
the community number two if you haven't
seen the other interviews with Evan
check those out it's really interesting
to see you know the progression over you
know over a year in a time frame so
check out those other videos and evan
has written a blog post for me over at
niche site project about zero search
volume keywords very interesting very
popular we're probably going to do a
video on that as well so keep an eye out
for the video and also check out the
stuff in the description so you can get
to it pretty easily
all right let's get to the interview now
hey what's going on is Doug Huntington
here and this is the Doug show chillin
with Evan Porter how are you today hey
I'm good Doug I'm glad to be back and
you have been on the show a few times so
I think this is your third third time on
yeah I'm gonna be a veteran at this
point yeah it's awesome well for the
people that don't know you can you give
a little bit of an intro about your
background and just pretty pretty brief
but yeah what's up with you
yeah sure I'll do the the short version
my name is Evan I used to work as a full
time writer and content marketer I got
my start in an agency and eventually
went on to
for one of the really big viral news
publishers and I got started doing my
own blogs and affiliate marketing coming
up on two years now maybe a year and a
half or so that I've been going at it
close to full time so these days I do I
do blogging full-time and yeah cool
that's pretty much where I'm at awesome
so in this is like a classic case where
like someone had skills obviously
writing is a very valuable skill for
being a blogger but you were able to
take those skills and you actually you
know worked at a big company so you're
able to like really learn like web
content well and now you're able to work
for yourself which is super cool and
that's how we got connected at first
because you you pinged me and you were
like hey I'm using the keyword golden
ratio and I was able to like get a lot
more traffic and the first time you are
on if I remember correctly it was like
you were making 4k per month and then
you did some more stuff then you're
making
8k which is awesome and then you know
this has been a couple almost a couple
years now so this is the update so where
are you at now this is sort of like this
summer time of 2019 yeah for sure well I
wish I could say it was all all rosy but
you know there's definitely been some
setbacks and trials and tribulations so
when we talked I think it was January of
this year January is like the really
peak season of the main niche that I'm
in so I had a great month everything was
looking really amazing for a while and
then I got hit I had got hit by an
update in March to the March 12th Google
update I saw my traffic just overnight
not like crazy I didn't lose everything
but I lost about 20 to 25% of my long
tail traffic it looks like you know we
were talking before this I didn't lose
any major rankings there was no obvious
symptom it just seemed like some of
those longer tail searches weren't
coming in anymore like they Google had
shuffled around the way they were
organizing those search results and yeah
my site got hurt a little bit and took a
bit of a setback there but overall the
business is still like pretty healthy
I'm still earning you know a full-time
income and just trying to rebuild what I
had lost there
got it and then like did did the
earnings drop correspondingly like the
25% as well or was it different yeah
more or less I definitely felt like a
lot of my money pages and the Amazon
affiliate type pages got hit the most
but you know I have multiple revenue
streams and they all kind of had gains
and losses in different areas so it's
hard to say exactly but yeah I mean the
overall revenue took a big dip as well
okay and how did you deal with that like
on you know just a personal level
cuz that's like this has happened to me
right it's a real kick in the boss so
how'd you get a lot of freaking out a
lot of cursing drinking no no I mean I
just reached out to smart people that I
know and and I was like hey what do you
know about this update like what's going
on was there a specific thing that
Google was targeting I never really got
a clear answer I mean I know a lot of
the times you don't really know right
people have guesses and predictions and
there's evidence that leans one way or
the other but you know I wish it was as
simple as you know you can just go flip
one button on your site and get
everything back but it's often quite a
bit more complicated than that so I just
had to kind of accept that okay this is
a setback and I got a I got to kind of
rebuild it a little bit I mean it was a
good thing that I didn't lose my main
keyword ranking so it's not like Oh
Google hates my site no I just kind of
saw a dip like I did again like that
longer retail traffic like potentially I
had some posts ranking for things that
they didn't really deserve to rank to
rank for and that's gone and so I just
gotta build it back up got it
and did you what did you do like
actually on the site did you try to add
some more like credibility or what what
was your approach and I'll just leave it
at that what was your approach yeah well
it definitely made me kind of take take
a step back and take stock of you know
my strategies and things like that so
I've been trying to get some more links
doing some more link building it's
something I've really neglected this
deep into the site and with
happy it being so big and making a good
amount of money I feel like that left it
a little bit vulnerable so I've been
able to get some good some good links
through you know kind of guest posting
and writing articles for like media
publications and things like that
I've looked at my site speed which I
realized was not ideal and so I've made
a couple tweaks they gotta bring that up
and just kind of turning over every step
yeah sure
so I think that the link building thing
is interesting because knock on wood I
haven't had any issues in the last few
years with any of the algorithm updates
generally especially in the last year so
2018-2019 my observation is most of the
people that have been hit usually don't
have very many backlinks to their site
across the board like I can't think of
an example where someone's like I was
crushing it with backlinks also my sec I
had just I haven't seen that so yeah you
mentioned you neglected it did you have
very many links like up until March
while the site's over two years old now
so it has accrued some natural backlinks
its accrue at a lot of social media
shares and and forum posts and things
like that I did one link building
campaign early in the site's
history which got a couple but other
than that no I wouldn't say it had like
a huge backlink profile you know but the
interesting thing is I have we talked
like I have two different sites and only
one really got hit by that update and
the other one is still growing very very
nicely so in terms of like the overall
way that I approach the content strategy
I don't think it was an issue I think it
was one of those things where you know
those those certain niches that Google
is really really tough on you know you
need to do more in certain niches to
have that authority got it and that said
like your other site is growing and you
said you have the same content approach
hopefully you're doing a little more
link building yeah yeah so like can you
give us an idea on like how old the
second site is like the amount of
traffic
and any other details that you want to
share yeah so the second site I started
last June so it's almost exactly a year
old right now and it has about 60 or 70
articles on it brings in 60 to 70
thousand page views a month and I think
last month it made just shy of just shy
of $2,000 so that one is performing
great for how old it is and the type of
cited it is gotcha so okay just one year
old $2,000 a month yes correct
okay so after six months did you see
like the Google sandbox lift and that
sort of thing that ya hear about
definitely I mean I've seen it so many
times now that it really is like you can
see it in your search console it's like
2 to 2
you know it just it is overnight
practically almost exactly at that
six-month mark if you've been putting in
the work and you have enough content to
see it yep awesome it's always good to
get like more data points so I have been
hearing there's like a one-year sandbox
too so like are you passed one year or
is it like gonna be in the next few days
here yeah passed one year I can't
remember if there was a surge but it
kind of seems to hum along like it'll
plateau and then it'll jump little
plateau and then it'll jump that's kind
of what I see in the search con console
in terms of the organic traffic so yeah
I mean it it lines up when you hit that
year point you definitely you have a lot
more possibilities as for what you can
rank for ok cool and let's see so we got
the links you're doing a little more so
are you doing like regular guest posting
or what's your approach with link
building yeah so what I've been trying
recently is uh you know my background is
in writing like I wrote for real media
publications and stuff like that so I've
been working on pitching like media
outlets like big media sites that are
relevant to my niche think like you know
like a Huffington Post that covers
everything you know there's almost no
topic that they don't cover and it's a
little bit different than a typical
guest post like you have to pitch and
you may even get paid for some of those
Opera
and you know you got to use your real
name you got to use a real photo you got
to have writing chops but you can often
get a link in your little author profile
that can go back to your site that can
be pretty powerful so that's kind of a
high effort approach to be pitching big
publications like that those big fish
but I feel like that's something that
not a lot of bloggers are gonna be able
to do and so with my background like
I've been going for it take advantage of
that that's awesome
and then I feel like you were doing some
Pinterest work in the past is that is
that right yeah definitely I use I do
utilize Pinterest and it's a great
traffic driver for me
but lately I've been trying to scale
down the time that I put into it because
I don't want it to become a time suck
and it's honestly not my favorite thing
to work on so my approach right now is
I've made pins for every post that I've
ever published and I make new ones as
they come up and I just have the smart
loop feature on tailwind going which is
just you kind of make a list of your
best performing pins and then it it
loops and it repented
over and over again you know every
couple months spacing them out
appropriately and I pin you know new
stuff as it comes up and that's
basically the strategy I like to keep it
really really simple so I don't spend
hours and hours on it okay and do you
have a handle like does that traffic
from Pinterest convert well or is it
just nice to have as far as like traffic
from another source yeah it's it's a it
can be a little bit bouncy you know
people their attention span isn't super
sharp on social media they can bounce in
and out but the good thing is that I'm
monetize with ads as well so you know
the raw traffic is valuable to me and I
finally got around to putting a basic
email capture on my site so I'm trying
to drive people into that too so at the
very least I'll get the ad revenue and
potentially some email signups cool got
you got you and what do you what network
you're using for your ads I'm a media
vine they're on both of my sites and
they've been awesome okay is there any
like like
minimum traffic requirement for media
vine and any other details you could
share yeah they have you need to have
25,000 sessions per month that's the
minimum to get in I think they like to
see a little bit of history with that
traffic level although I was able to get
in a little bit early on my second site
because I had a I had a previous site in
good standing with them and so that
helps but you know they can be pretty
picky like if your traffic is not
us-based or if you're getting 90 percent
of your traffic on one post there's
certain things that they don't like so
it can be a little bit difficult to get
in but if you have 25,000 sessions per
month that's the minimum yeah okay cool
and I guess those are sort of like the
high level questions for the update but
like do you any any other interesting
things that have been going on that you
want to share about either of your sites
or just doing this stuff in internet
marketing yeah yeah I know I've actually
been in an interesting phase lately and
maybe some of your viewers and readers
can relate to this because and you I'm
sure you can relate to this but I'm at
this point now where the stuff that you
do in the processes you use to build a
site up from nothing to a couple
thousand dollars a month like that's not
necessarily what's gonna get you to you
know 10k a month 15k a month and the
whatever your goal might be and so yeah
when you when a site gets big and it has
a lot of traffic and it's making money
it actually gets harder to grow I think
like just adding a post here and there
it doesn't really move the needle
anymore so I'm kind of in a place where
I'm testing I'm testing lots of
different things lots of different types
of content and promotional strategies to
see like what's gonna work and what I
can start to really scale up because I
think it's I think it's time cool well
let us know what it is whatever you are
whatever you uncover the mystery yeah
once I figure it all out yeah yeah yeah
I think you're right i mean like you I
mean you started a new site within a
year you've had like a pretty big
milestone that so many people are like
if I could just make
like you know 2,000 bucks 3000 bucks
like that's enough for them to quit
their job and like keep pushing but like
yeah it's another it's another set of
skills and I think you know potential
obviously you're a strong very good
writer and it may be around like like
the link building stuff like you got a
match up the to like you don't have to
be awesome at either one necessarily as
long as you got a little bit of each but
it's funny I was just talking to someone
else recently and part of its perhaps my
fault right where I'm just like publish
a bunch of content don't build any links
it'll be okay
like that that's enough that's like the
cost of entry and then after that like
if you can do the other stuff that
everyone else hates doing link building
then you could be alright so yeah yeah
for sure I mean interesting things start
to happen like when you've got a site
that's old and it has a lot of content
and a lot of traffic like yeah you can
publish a new post and get new traffic
but a post you wrote two years ago might
start slipping down the rankings so you
got to do a little bit more than just
like publish one you post a week to you
know to continue to grow but like early
on it's not hard to go from a hundred
bucks a month to five hundred like that
can happen in one month but yeah those
like tiny invisible incremental gains
like that's what you're seeing whenever
when your site is at a certain size so
you need to overcome that somehow and
that's kind of where I'm I'm at right
now is in that restore a tidge izing
phase cool cool so we are we're gonna be
talking about another couple topics in
future episodes so you actually wrote a
guest post for a niche site project so
thanks for doing that but it was around
zero search volume so we'll talk about
that in another episode people keep an
eye out for that one or an ear out if
you're listening to the podcast Evan
where can people find you out so you can
actually go to words by Evan Porter calm
it's all one-word words by Evan Porter
it's my old personal writers blog but
lately I've been jotting down some
things that I'm learning and stuff that
I'm trying in my journey as a blogger
and yeah I think you might find it
interesting
cool so I'll put a link for that and
thanks a lot Evan
we'll catch up with you next time thanks
dad
thanks again to Evan I really appreciate
you taking the time to share your story
with the niche site project community
and everyone go check out his blog post
on the Xero search fly them keywords
very interesting all right that's it for
now
and we will catch you on the next
episode
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