hey what's going on it's Doug Huntington
here from niche site project and the
Doug show in this video I interview Matt
Barnett from Bonjour oh I'm a user of
bun zero and if you're unfamiliar with
the app it is a way to boost customer
engagement with perfectly time personal
videos and I read that directly from the
website and I encourage you to check it
out now this is a SAS product that like
I said I personally use and basically
when someone enrolls in a course of mine
I send them a personal message and I
actually record a message for each
individual so instead of like trying to
like reduce the amount of touch points
with an individual I'm trying to
increase it and in fact send even more
personal messages just to make sure like
they know that I am actually reading
their emails that they're sending me in
I'm involved so it's been a great tool
for me I've had excellent results in
personally in my courses especially
five-figure a niche site I've been able
to help people start and complete the
work a little more effectively so I
think there's a piece in there where if
people know that I'm sending them a
personal message they're a little more
inclined to get started and do the work
so there are many ways to use Bonjour oh
and I'll place some links for some of
the use cases that you could check out
so I use it for courses but if you have
an agency maybe you design websites or
something like that you can actually
like send these personal video messages
to your leads or potential customers to
help you know bring them into your
ecosystem so that's a really smart guy
and I am excited to share this video
with you so let's get to it now hey
what's going on it's Doug Pennington
here from niche site project and I'm
here with Matt Barnett from Bonjour oh
how are you today great thanks Doug got
my coffee sigh all
the guy excellent and for the people
that don't know you a lot of people may
not have heard of you or Bonjour oh so
can you give a quick intro about what
you do and what the company does yeah
sorry
I've um Andre so I'm actually a signer
originally so fan of the company
veracity cross product whenever I can
and then what do in today's day every
other job needs to be done we've Padre
essentially we are a plug-in for CMS
that prompts you to send personalized
via messages at specific points on the
customer journey to improve conversions
activations and advocacy amongst users
obviously to grow lifetime value of
customers awesome
and I'm a user of bun zero and I became
aware I think for the first time from
Pat Flynn and he's kind of from from the
beginning that's how I got my start
online and I think I saw him using the
tool as sort of an onboarding for
courses and I started using it for that
specifically as well and it's been huge
for me and like course refunds dropped
quite a bit I think it's somewhere like
20 plus percent and just the the
enthusiasm that the students have after
I send them a personal message which I
do 100% like one on one a message to the
person they're they're thrilled so that
that's how I use it specifically and you
mentioned you know a CRM plugin to help
basically bring people through the
customer journey so it sounds kind of
it's pretty niche I would say so how did
this product come about site look so we
we're an agency and we're based here in
Australia which is the middle of nowhere
and their clients were in the UK
primarily so we dealt with big FM's ucg
client so UK Paris New York now when you
live on the other side the world in the
complete opposite timezone then
converting
sales leads isn't the easiest so we
decide well we actually we actually work
in video tech so we kind of understood
the space a little bit and I started
sending personalized videos to every
single lead that we have come into our
phone so you built a little hack so I
just take a ferry to work so I'll be on
the boat wind in my hair couldn't really
understand what I was saying but you
know I see John from Ogilvy signed up
and I'm like hey John this is Matt here
and suddenly team of all the companies
called for Bates you know you already
work with Danone and Proctor and Gamble
and Unilever and his from the projects
we've done you know I'd love to have a
chat or come in and pitch you guys when
I'm in London in a week's time and so
the first day's contact they had off me
was that video it was very casual we
kind of winged it but it worked
amazingly and so we tripled our color
conversion rate overnight and the reason
looking back with hindsight wasn't the
fact that I was doing these videos it
was a fact that in a world where
everyone was kind of sending out what's
making kind of lead follow-ups and try
and like get get sales demo straightaway
I can take him a minute out of my day to
kind of connect personally and so is
that time I was giving up look it it was
probably quite funny as well it's quite
unique so it's to that but it also got
across my personality and they watched
it and being creative agencies and
creative companies and they were like
look these look like guys that we should
have a chat to at least and so he
started a book along with them and off
that now honestly probably wouldn't have
thought much more of it until all those
clients asked if they could use this
this video email tool says this is two
years ago and we were like yeah go for
it and so we put them on it I mean it
looked like a dog's dinner it didn't it
wasn't built for anyone except ourselves
they managed to get it working and then
lo and behold one of their clients then
came to us and asked if they could use
it and so you know talk about side
hustles one thing you shouldn't do when
you're running a new business is start a
second business and I mean my CTO I
think we had I think maybe had like two
old people come in and ask if they could
use it and having beers in the Friday
and we're like you know we're gonna need
to build this
and so it built a very early beta
version we got out and then honestly it
just snowballed and that company is now
overtaken the original company well it
overtook it quite quite a while ago
it's the extent that that's where most
of the team when 90% of the team that
work on their day to day basis okay in
verb 8 was an agency doing doing some
work and it's still out there operating
but just smaller yeah yeah it does it
does video research for course it does
visit video qualitative research there's
two like leash I mean that it's it's a
huge leaf its research I'm not obsessed
with research but we basically go and
collect videos of people inputting you
know developing countries that come back
of them from testing and using demos so
it's actually a very different business
model whereby you're doing sales and
client development whereas interesting
bondo is generally an inbound kind of
business we do a lot of affiliates of
like marketing through affiliates as
well so in that I need to be starting
your business we start an entire new
business model which has been
interesting I will say to the least sure
do you have any like fun stories of
mistakes that you made as you were like
transitioning and like running the two
businesses at the same time and like
moving over I'll say money I think I
think I think let's say you come from a
sales industry so we were great we were
doing pitching yet so pitching to large
large clients long sales times you know
six months plus and to get in there very
sticky clients fade in process board
room had to go build an inbound funnel
now at the beginning I'd still go and do
a lot a lot of sales calls and coffee
meetings and in-person meetings and what
I learned is that it sounds brutal but
it's actually a waste of time for this
business model so we still do demos we
still do onboarding but we did it all
over zoom and online as you can see
today I'm at home before heading into
the office I'd own more in four states
now it actually allows us to get a lot
more meetings done than we would do
face-to-face it allows us to hit the
point quicker we have clients who moving
fast and who purchase faster so the
beginning we kind of like
we tried to shoot shoehorn like an old
process in the new business and I mean
luckily we were getting enough in band
that was driving as ahead but we had of
your strong track try to convert that
way and we were I mean running out of
time we were pulling all hours and it
was kind of killing us you know recently
went to a big change we've we've
actually streamlined operations
massively so that without we can handle
a lot probably three or four times as
many customers per individual in the
company then we cut the beginning and
that streamline process has allowed us
to grow a lot faster scale a lot faster
and it's reduce the stress the team
which is which is great as well well in
so just through streamlining the process
now was that just through iterating and
seeing where the weak points were or how
did you approach that like improvement
and being able to scale to that many
more customers so a lot of iteration
like some will be product says Somers
Point development so onboarding the way
we build the UX and the you are learning
some is RCS process as well so how we do
it onboard in CS where we take our time
with clients something's about team
growth as well so we are it's with
twelve people but we're in six countries
now so we've we've taken the kind of
idea of a remote working kind of and
then just kind of ramped it up so again
be basis for yet with where their
customer base is mostly States fired by
Europe this make sense a bit as well but
of you try to cover those time zones
we've actually found that we could be a
lot more efficient working across
different countries so different people
awake at different times they refreshed
at different times they actually bring
different industry knowledge as well you
know for instance we moved a lot
supports at sports now in South Africa
compared to Australia or the US which is
more cost-effective it's better timezone
we're able to get so much more
experience as well so again starting to
look at the world as your playground
rather than just your country like I can
tell you it opens up opportunities you
wouldn't imagine exist very cool and you
said you have just twelve employees
that's it that's it yeah Wow any like
contractors out there freelancers doing
pieces of
work or is it just the 12 yeah see yes
we have we have it we have contracts is
him in there like illustrator is a
children's book illustrator based in
Poland a mother of a couple kids so yeah
we do spend it what we do is we do
source at a team and contacts is pretty
intensely I think if you want to go Lane
the key is to get you have to get really
good people in each role and obviously
you're looking for people who can
fulfill quite quite a substantial role
with this kind number of team members to
rather than carve doing things in-house
and over here and maybe picking up
people who are kind of like bees rather
than pays when you hear the world like
can you just find a players in their
niches and it's far more efficient you
know and you can start you start
freelancing and then when they get to
speed made that offer
bring it on full-time you know or be a
full-time contractor if you don't you
don't have to go to certain companies
nothing else if you want this full-time
contracting role you still then involve
those team members into team calls into
all the culture pieces like we fly our
team together each year as well so if
you start by people into that and
they'll buy in anyway and they'll give
you more more over time gotcha and it
sounded like you had a co-founder with
your CTO I guess and would you call
yourself the CEO of the company or is
there a title papa sorry yeah see I
think it doesn't quite fit still fits
weird with me because it feels it still
feels like like you're a boss so I'm
like wait we're a team you know yeah
when I was gonna say you know I was
doing some research ahead of time and
people could go check out like all the
team members on the about page I'll put
a link in the description and all that
stuff but I'm like shocked that the team
so lean and I love that because I came
from a sort of a corporate background
where teams were big you have a lot of
waste introduced into that now it's
interesting to me with 12 people does
everyone report to you or is there some
layer of manage
they I guess reduces the number of like
points of contact that you have to you
know work with on a daily basis yeah so
you start to bring in layers now
obviously as she starts to grow he
starts a higher mid-level genius as well
and we have with two very only have one
we happily one junior member and Timmy
and the government levels and then we
have hired mid senior so we tend to hire
people who we can its most aquatic us
and who were kind of like on their
journey at that found second third stage
but aren't kind of set in their ways
turns reporting yeah we has instructed
obviously working team so I can't sit
more important team have a great zero as
well who's like my right-hand man and
having that kind or teams we have it we
have what we call a brains trust call
once a week which involves my head of
marketing my CTO my CIO and myself so
between the four of us we essentially
make the decisions of the company I run
the company and so that Monday meeting
it's quite straights about half an hour
long and all we do is bring distance
decisions to the table to be made so
that could be anything it could be just
a you know should we invest in in this
type of channel in marketing should make
this product decision it's not really
for chitchat it's kind of just just to
get message made given the fact that
we're in different locations that
happens everything week without fail so
I think as long as you have that core
team around you yeah well as the Dro you
do struggle trying to manage the team
and like what you need to put structure
in place you need to put hierarchy in
place you can't have a completely flat
organization you know it passed so
another people yeah I think it's
something like or I heard once the
optimal was like six otherwise at that
point it gets to be a little bit too
many so you know it's different I think
everyone I think Troy tribal sighs
wasn't it baked open seven so you can
have at seven many at twenty-one and
then you get to whatever's next like
sixty three yeah I think it's like yeah
3x like every time you triple it you run
into some now
issues with the number of contact
planner and other science behind it but
I think we're talking about the same
thing yeah I mean it happens i mean when
it when you in it you see it and you see
there's breakdowns and we lie because
fans probably in the team like we've had
we've had team breakdowns and we've had
miscommunication we struggled to find a
way and a process that works across
different time zones like remote working
I think a lot about remote working
within the states and it's it's still a
level easy because young teams like same
time zone mote working on complete
different time zones is hard like in his
heart and when you have team issues they
are compounded because people can't just
talk and you will have them because
you'll have difficulties and you have
challenges you have miscommunication and
disagreements like like I mean that
that's a healthy part of the team most
of times ends make it very difficult to
manage I want to go back to one of the
things you mentioned before I guess
before by Jareau came to be you were
making informal videos and you said you
were on a boat or something like that
and I know that's definitely a contrast
with the other marketers that were
potentially approaching the there the
leads or the prospects or whatever they
were
is there anything anything else that you
think the informal approach like brings
to the table like why is it so effective
but I've seen it to never like even a
bad video that I do where the sound
isn't great is so much better than like
a template email so what are your
observations with this well exactly
excited the web place has changed a lot
and it's challenging more so we say
informal you know really it's just
pulling down the barriers and the
corporate barriers that existed before I
think it used to be four-year about you
know 20 years 30 is time it was you know
suits and ties for work and then
t-shirts for home and an evident to
shell mix and that has changed and you
see it with our customer base we have
like so many but I like my podcasts of
doing things like that you know people
in the home that they don't know if it's
not wearing time right we do have
clients in twos and ties we do do
corporate but even even those guys the
videos they do that make sense the ones
when they're on the coffee meetings and
what it is is it's not actually
fundamental change people have always
like people relationships have been key
to why we want to work with you why
wanting it back you know used to it when
used together to the to you gross to
every single day you knew your name we
knew your order and everything else then
we can go online we've yeah an online
kind of forces barriers you know even
more in the wrong direction because
something that there's a physical like
distance between clients and businesses
if you get back to informed informality
it's the kind of conversational piece
you start to make bonds with customers
again as people not as customers if that
makes sense
I think people crave that I mean we are
we are social animals
you know we meant it we meant to exist
in groups
into socialized meds talking you know in
today's life online that's harder to do
so we do stand out potentially this is
maybe a business a thing of the moments
as becomes commonplace right now I think
we all crave that interaction it's very
different it's not normal you you
obviously spending time with the clients
is therefore valued you know more than
it density should be because no one else
is doing it so you know break break down
barriers tape ties off but we see
something like I think it's something
like 30 percent of our or the message is
sent on ponder Oh a cent on people's
commutes to work and so I find that
fascinating cuz what it means there's a
fundamental shift in how people are are
going to from the workplace so they're
but using the commute time for
productive work whereas they would do it
for reading whatever else before they're
using that to you know connect with
classes before they get the office and
become the office person and it's it's
just her telling that journey into a
whole different you know into like it
like a drains workers now journey with
customers right super interesting yeah
and people are on the streets people are
in Kaka calf cafes and crossing the
roads and having cars honk at them and
stuff but it's beautiful yeah it's
amazing look at that you like this is
this is back to real life
yep it's funny you mentioned that so I I
work from home you know so I walked the
dog every morning so usually my dog
Georgie ends up in any of the Bonjour
O's that I send and people really
appreciate it because it's like hey
you're out on the walk with me this
morning and I show her in the Canberra
and whatever so yeah very very
interesting is it's all personal I love
it so I know obviously bun-bun 0 started
from a pivot where do you see like
whatever you can reveal like where do
you see puncher of going in the future
or like videos becoming obviously more
and more prevalent super important I've
shifted a lot of my stuff over to
YouTube just in general but yeah what
other what other
after we have coming from Bonjour oh
yeah say so at the Corvair your Henry
says again the games like it's about
video I think video is a medium and
video supports what it is that we're
doing so what we're doing is basically
encouraging people to spend more time
with customers at the right time so I
think you know you look at that business
we say that we have made operations very
lean we've reduced you know we've put
automation in but the automation is
there to reduce the jobs I don't have to
do so I can do the jobs where well my
time is important and that turns out to
be a lot of time spending that time on
on customers even though we have a like
the pretty huge customer base if I spent
a little bit's time here and there at
the right time that's valuable that
helps us converts and retain clients and
hence reduce churn as we're saying so
where I see bond really going is into a
system that helps you predict when to
plug that time into clients
now we'll offer communication tool so
yes video of course here we're spending
over a billion capabilities into
screencasting into other areas but don't
think it has to be limited to that one
medium
I think whatever medium works at a time
as long as you can show that you're
there being personal and thinking about
the client and giving them real value
now is that could be like that could be
text it could be you know blogs that are
catered towards individual clients in
some kind of way right now we're
focusing on building essentially
campaign engine that allows you to run
an onboarding campaign or a retention
campaign or a conversion campaign that's
a little bit smarter about when to talk
to certain clients it one things we do
is off off serums and mailing lists and
off lead forms we actually pull
information into Bonjour so we can tell
you what steps that clients already done
so when you send me a message you can
personalize it to them and so again a
little more smarts around how do we help
people do the personalization thing that
scales so so you never have to spend
more than 30 seconds
but in that time you can make each piece
of content genuinely unique to that
individual so really it's that engine
and if we can crack that and it's not an
easy thing to do
it's quite a large thing we see us as
kind of the the kind of human layer that
sits on top of all these other systems
that Kemeny purely do automation and so
you've got your automation that runs
which is super important and then you
have us for these high-value touch
points that again increase you know the
lifetime value of any client whether
it's a parent stay longer having more
than convert having less than Lea having
more than toast demos that's where we
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