hey what's going on
welcome to the Doug show my name is Doug
Huntington and in this episode I talked
to my friend Dom Wells and he's the
founder of human proof designs though we
do have some news that we'll be sharing
and he sold it he sold human proof
designs and he's working on a new
project called an folio so that's where
you could find him now on folio Koh I'll
put links in the description and show
notes and stuff like that and DOM and I
have known each other for a little while
actually since we both started online
roughly
we've sort of been in touch we started
our respective blogs around the same
time and luckily we sort of focused on
different areas so I focused more on
like creating a course and teaching and
that sort of thing and Dom focused more
on the services business side of like
the things that we talked about which is
Amazon affiliate marketing primarily we
talked about some other things too but
that's kind of our focus in both cases
now I'm not going to spoil too much from
the interview but I will tell you that
we talk about human proof designs quite
a bit because I'm interested in the
service business side of it because I
didn't I didn't want to do that part so
it was interesting hearing how Dom grew
the team hiring full-time employees
managing the remote team in all the
details around that eventually as you
can imagine from the title of this they
were pulling in seven figures of revenue
which is over a million bucks for the
people they can't count that high or
you're not sure about the number of
commas in there or anything like that
but anyway they were making a lot of
money basically which is cool
moving forward we just talk about why
DOM wanted to start something new how he
got the idea and why he's working on on
folio versus you know sticking with
human proof designs or something
different so with that said I will just
mention if people haven't subscribed to
a niche site project the email list and
your interest
than learning more about starting an
affiliate site or even productivity or
some random stuff you should sign up so
just go to niche site project comm click
the green button enter your name and
email and I'll send you a whole bunch of
free cool stuff that said let's head to
the interview with Dom Wells right now
[Music]
hey what's going on it's duck Huntington
here and I'm with my good friend Dom
wells how are you doing today yeah I'm
doing well
happy to be here it's always fun when we
have a conversations together yeah it's
been it's been a while we were chatting
off off the record there for a few
minutes and it was like you know it's
been several months maybe a year since
we've chatted so it's good to catch up
and for the folks that don't know you
can you give a little bit of an intro
about how you like sort of got into the
space of online marketing and sort of
what you're working on now yeah I got
started with affiliate marketing in 2012
I feel like I didn't really get started
till 2013
because 2012 was pretty much reading
stuff building websites that failed
miserably making my first few dollars
online and then trying to figure it out
from there and 2013 was when I first
started making like a few hundred
dollars a month and and I was just
building basically Miche sites just like
my first site was stopping smoking which
was bad niche site because it's not here
it's like one of the broadest most
complicated topics out there but I had
just quit smoking so I seemed relevant
at the time and then I started to have a
little bit of success and in very late
2013 probably more like 2014 I I started
humor group designs which was a company
where we basically did services
specifically done for you website
creation for affiliate marketers mostly
beginners who wanted to get started I've
seen a gap in the market
where there were a lot of people buying
in these kind of turnkey starter
websites or flipper and and they were I
think warrior for him as well and they
were mostly scams or just junk websites
that we're never going to get anyone
anywhere so I was like why don't I build
good starter websites with training and
you know community around them and a
support group and all of that and then
that pretty much became the thing I did
for for a very long time for about five
years and I grew that somehow managed to
grow grow it to a million dollars in
towards the end of last year so late
2018 I started on polio which was based
on an idea I'd actually had in 2014 and
then forgotten about and then we had if
Yuri have an idea then so I started that
and that's basically working with
investors and people who want to buy
established websites like maybe $30,000
hundred thousand dollar websites but
they just don't want to run them or they
don't have the skill to run them so my
team and I will we'll be like the
operator at the website and we'll have a
management fee and a profit share with
the investor that's pretty much my focus
these days awesome so that is a awesome
trajectory so you started not knowing
anything was a little rough in the
beginning you became successful right
you started making some money saw the
gap in the market to provide some
services for the market and then slowly
grew that up into a big business sold it
and then you found another gap in the
market through you know being you know
in the trenches with the market I guess
music market a lot here but the point is
you identified another gap and now
you're you're filling that awesome
now most people in the world haven't
started a website and maybe they're
thinking about a side gig but
like in the beginning I know how
frustrating it was for me making
mistakes and you alluded to you know
many failures before you have any
success can you take us back like what
was it like like what were you thinking
how did you keep going when it looked
like you were just making a bunch of
mistakes I don't know how I kept going
really I think it was because there was
so much to learn and so many different
things to get excited about which was
definitely I guess it hindered me to
some extent as well because you know
there's the shiny object syndrome and I
was being like maybe I'll do like local
Legion or maybe I'll try and do like cpa
networks like stuff like peer fly and
for a while I was on Squidoo and those
sites
so those things definitely slowed my
progress but because there was always
something new to try I guess it always
meant that when I failed with something
I was like oh well I'll try that thing
instead or I'll I'll try a different
niche instead and so I just kind of
something motivated me to not give up I
guess because I had seen in a people
succeeding that I felt like it must be
possible like I I think my biggest doubt
was not that it was possible it was that
I could do it because I've always been a
bit of an underachiever and so I was
like in the back of my mind something
was like yeah but just cuz someone else
is gonna see doesn't mean you will but I
don't know I guess I just kind of lied
to myself i BS to myself enough that
eventually it became true was like now I
can do it and I really just there were
lots of small things as well like I was
able to kind of like maybe my first web
site didn't do great but I got better at
installing WordPress like I remember the
very first web site I couldn't figure
anything out with WordPress like what's
the difference between a page in a post
and all of that and so the next time I
set up a site I was like this was much
easier and then maybe my second web site
made $10 in a monk
and so my third website I felt like well
I can make a little bit of money and I
can set a website up sorry I don't know
I just it just kept getting better every
time and eventually to be honest I still
feel like it's the same process like
it's just the numbers are a little bit
big enough yep
and actually that was my next question
as you were making this statement it's
like does that feeling go away
cuz I know it doesn't for me it's like
partially imposter syndrome and you know
there's a lot of labels for it but at
the end of the day you just don't know
if what you're doing is gonna work even
if you've done it a couple times so has
it gone away for you specifically for
like on folio are you like yeah a
hundred percent like this is go no I
think it does stay I think maybe it
changes slightly like basic stuff like
you see someone else is doing the same
issues you are the same just the same
idea and you're like oh no and then it's
like come on you should know by now that
competitors are a good thing because
invalidate your idea and also you know
your there's always going to be other
people so you still have these thoughts
and these doubts but I think they
they're a lot easier to dismiss now
because you're like what am i doing you
know you push them aside whereas when
you get them in the beginning you you
haven't got that kind of confidence bank
to to make it withdrawal from so it's um
it's yeah it's harder in the beginning
but I don't think those feelings ever go
away
you just get better with dealing with
yeah yeah totally who I was just looking
for validation for myself I guess since
I still feel that sort of you know
indecision at times and you're nervous
and you don't know if it's gonna work
and you just have to push through so
alright still you know back in that
early sort of part of your timeline
there how did you decide to focus more
on services versus you know tripling and
doubling down on just creating more
sites or
did you I'm making an assumption there
but how did you get into the services
business and decide that that was going
to be the main deal to be honest it was
just where people would pay me I really
think like it was just about figuring
out how I could make some money and when
I first started I wasn't really
interested in services I just wanted
like the kind of passive affiliate model
I didn't want to deal with customers and
all of that
I didn't wanna build become an authority
or build a like personal brand or
anything and like looking back is the
easiest way to scale a business is to
build a like a personal brand as both of
us know but I think really yeah it was
just I was still growing my own site
some one question I got a lot was why do
you sell sites to people rather than
just grow your own the answer in the
beginning was because I can research
like 20 sites a month and I can build 20
sites a month but I can't run 20 sites
so you know maybe I'll run five and sell
15 and so there's like a supply and
demand thing as well people were gonna
pay me to build them a site so I did
still run my own sites and scale them
but I just also sold others and then as
the team got bigger I realized well I
can focus more on my own portfolio now
because I have more bandwidth again so
kind of was like first it was just me
doing my own thing then it was just
growing human foot designs and then it
was growing both and then I now it's
focusing on my own portfolio again and
it is kind of funny because I if someone
said do you like service based
businesses I'd be like now they suck I
hate like objectively of course but at
the same time I keep falling into
service businesses and I keep doing well
with so I guess I don't I don't
it's SmartNet you know but I mean I
experimented with some service
businesses and actually recently did in
the past six months
again realized and remembered we
remembered that I don't really like it
that much for many of the reasons which
people know of service businesses
there's a lot of clients you have to
keep the pipeline full customer service
is big
especially with higher ticket items in
our market of internet marketing where
there's some scammy people you know to
have good customer service is essential
so yeah very interesting very very
interesting it's good that you're like
embracing the fact that you do good with
services so you may as well keep moving
with it
so when you start at human proof was it
was it just you building the sights like
how did you grow the team can you just
tell us about the trajectory of that up
until when you sold it yes so in the
beginning it was just me I I did
everything myself except write content
and in fact the very first websites I
built I didn't even write the content I
was just like I'm just gonna research in
each do the keyword research build a
website and hand it over but then I was
like people need content so I was
outsourcing content I think at first I
was using I writer and that I wrecked it
was great because you could get content
turned around very quickly but it was
bad because the content was never that
good so there was a lot of editing
required it was also quite cheap as well
so I could keep the cost of the websites
down
and then the first hire I made was
someone to assemble the sites for me so
I was just like okay I'll give you the
articles when they're done and you just
assemble the sites and it was very much
because they were done through sites
they were all built the same way so it
was like here's the articles upload them
do the formatting and they do all the
other stuff like install the plugins and
so on and then he was quite good with
plugins that he was able to create kind
of like push-button WordPress
installations where he would you know
sort of human proof skeleton would be
there and then he just loaded me
articles and then the next high as I
made will writers because I was sick of
dealing with our writer and I realized I
could actually get it cheaper if I paid
in bulk so I was like hey I need ten
articles if you order one article maybe
you're gonna pay like 10 dollars an
article but I could say hey here I need
someone to do ten articles for me for
like $60 and someone would be like I
don't just need 60 instead of 10 I'm
over that yeah I'll do that
so then next the next thing I needed was
an editor it's just like it's someone
who was interesting charge of the
content so then I would just give them
the keywords they'd order the constant
they'd pass it to the site builder
person and then the next thing I
outsource twas I brought on a project
manager to just deal with everything so
that I could then focus more on
marketing the business and writing blog
posts and all of the like working on the
business type stuff and then as that
scaled we then brought in people below
all of those peoples so then they'd be
like the project manager would have an
assistant and the website builder would
have like four website builders under
them and then we ended up with like five
keyword researchers and then we would
promote one of those five to the head of
the keyword research team so that my
project manager who became my CEO could
then move on and build at the writing
team and that process took probably a
year and a half really to get really
well and it went from like I've never
hired anyone up at work to up work for
sending me Christmas cards because I'm
like a VIP customer in the space of
about two years maybe yeah so I very
quickly and the I think the real key was
that I didn't hire everyone myself I
hired someone whose job it was to hire
people so I was like so when I brought
Brad on who is the human group design
CEO
even today he he would be like right
what's the biggest bottleneck and I'd
say keyword research and so okay teach
me keyword
such so I told him how we do it he did
it by himself for two weeks and then he
was like right I feel like I'm competent
enough and I was I was giving him
feedback dream it's two weeks and so he
was like right I feel like I'm competent
enough to teach it so I'm gonna go out
and hire like for Filipinos to do it for
us and I was like okay so he did that
and then he trained them and then after
two more weeks he said yeah one of them
is really good I think he should be the
manager and I said okay and then and
then that was the keyword research team
and then he was the next bottleneck and
so it's like ordering the content and
then rinse and repeat and so we did that
systematically for or whatever I just
said like 18 months 12 around 18 months
to get everything done to the point
where I was completely out of operations
except maybe replying to customer emails
and stuff and we were able to launch way
more products so like in the beginning
if a customer said to me how can you
also do SEO can you also do pbn mix can
you also do ebooks blah blah blah blah
we would say no because we didn't have
the bandwidth but now whenever we wanted
to launch a new service it was really a
case of me designing the service Brad
figuring out the logistics of how that
service would be delivered how much it
would cost how much we should therefore
charge and then training the necessary
people we would basically just launch
the product and it was very smooth so we
went from being like ground to a whole
customers asking for refunds wondering
why that products isn't delivered yet to
being able to like launch a new service
in like two weeks because it's like this
this sort of team that system we've very
cool in you know just hearing you talk
about that it is very systematic it's an
iterative approach so that you can like
make progress as you go learn from each
time you
a new product and all of them makes
sense and that's something I've never
done with any service business that I
tried to do which I know is I'm going
through it I'm like do I want to do I
want to push through this and then I
always decide now so I'm glad I'm glad
people like you are doing it and it's a
good overlap I mean I think when I think
when you and I first met we started our
blogs and we you know we were in the
same circles a little bit and I mean
we're competitors right we're kind of we
didn't know what we were doing exactly
and you know eventually we had two
different markets so we were sort of
focusing on where there's a great
overlap very little stepping on toes so
it's been you know good relationship
where we can work together versus like
you know talk bad about each other or
something like that so kind of meta but
that's my observation so any thoughts on
that like on our relationship yeah sure
yeah yeah on the or the the - like our
two businesses and as we were getting
started just to decide to collaborate
versus you know be enemies I guess
because I have approached people and I'm
I'm like we could probably work together
well and they just completely ignore my
email or they just the rude and they're
like no go you know go out for yourself
right so so any other observations on
that yeah I mean I think I can probably
draw a straight line from like the day I
started trying to approach other people
to kind of where I am now and there were
people that didn't reply like you know
one of the first people are contacted
was Spencer Hawes and he he replied but
my he wasn't gonna collaborate with me
because he didn't really know who I was
buying that and so I was like okay maybe
I should start smaller and there were
other people who I messaged like tone
Tran who was from cloud living who was
like I'm already interested in promoting
your stuff but here's some feedback
here's how you could improve it and
because of that we actually maintain the
relationship and I actually went to turn
the wedding like last September so this
you know he said no but in a very
respectful way and actually whenever I
launched services I was like they have
to pass like the tongue test or the the
gale test from authority hacker because
like if those guys like your stuff it
means it's good quality and so then yeah
there were people like Authority hackers
who again weren't really interested in
promoting my stuff but they were like
nice guys and they were still happy and
we've linked to each other and stuff
like that and then yeah there were
people who would just read but then
there were people that you who replied
Matthew Alan he was very friendly early
on who else John Havel was sort of
ultimately ended up becoming a
competitor through his association with
brown builders but in the beginning like
he was friendly and we're still friendly
but I mean we in the beginning we were
more willing to work together than later
on and yeah like Empire flippers as well
they were huge and helping me so I think
it's just kind of one of those things
where it's like you just have to reach
out to everyone in the space and maybe
maybe not just reach out like hey link
to me hey be my collaborator but you're
gonna get some people who you Bible it
early on and some people who you don't
that's just how it goes and I think a
lot of the success on folios had because
we're would barely really marketed it
apart from the fact that I could come on
podcasts and stuff and send a few emails
out but it's already like on course to
be a pretty good year and I think a lot
of that comes to the fact that I've
spent years like building up contacts
and and networking and just generally
making friends with people and I think
it like in your case sometimes there was
maybe
incentives to not share each other's
stuff sometimes there's more incentive
like I know we promoted your course for
a while
and then we had our own course so kind
of didn't make sense and then but I
think there's I guess while all that's
going on like we were always maintaining
like a kind of cordial friendship anyway
which means that just stuffs right I
don't it's always positive so yep but
and in fact you know I heard you were
working on something new I said let's
talk about it come from come on the show
so we could tell people about it so it
all makes sense just I mean if people
are watching out there and you're
worried about competition like maybe you
don't have to worry too much like the
rising tide lifts all boats and all that
all the people that you mentioned or
friendly are still like they're still
doing something and they're moving on to
other things so maybe that has something
maybe that's evidence to like being you
know nice and friendly and professional
as far as networking is a good idea
versus you know trying to beat people up
out there so okay so moving Oh were you
gonna say something there no I was just
gonna say like you're right like and you
never know if like four years later
you're gonna bump into these people and
become friends with them like like I
bumped into spencer and chris guthrie
at traffic and conversion and san diego
last last march and it was like oh hey
yeah how are you I know you had beers
together and stuff and so it's like I
was i hack I got you eventually you know
my friends that's funny
so yeah in like the other thing like you
said you know you you emailed Spencer
back in the day and like he didn't know
who you are but now you've you know
you've been around you've proven you're
you know a responsible knowledgeable
person you're running a solid business
and there's a lot of social proof out
there - I guess support that so I mean
at this point he's confident that you're
not going to you know do something like
that the problem is if someone promotes
you and then you turn out to be like a
bad dude then they sort of lose some
credibility with their audience so that
that's the risk out there and I know
people have approached me in there
they're trying I mean they want me to
like promote their product or something
like that and I don't know who they are
maybe they're a little bit rude in the
email they don't even tell me their last
name like that sort of stuff like so
it's a little it's a little hard so it's
hard to separate you know who's who
I guess professional so yeah and yeah to
some extent you know maybe you open
email you scan it and you you're not
even going to bother checking out what
what their offer is because of the
bandwidth and you're just like oh
whatever I'll deal with yeah I deal with
them later and sometimes I remember
actually I think Chris Lee from ranked
Excel he sent me an email promoting his
course when he very first started it and
I think that was just an example of an
email I opened and sort of glazed over
and was like I think about that later
and then I closed the email and I never
thought about it again and then I think
I saw like Stewart Walker from me shacks
promoting the course or something like
that or someone and I was like this
sounds familiar and I went back and open
the email and was like oh yeah hey Chris
how's a guy so it kind of once you've
been on the other side of it you can
kind of realize like what it's like when
you're being but when you're doing the
outreach you can see what the other
person is like and they're probably they
they're not deliberately ignoring you or
trying to be like trying to be a rude or
anything but they probably just don't
have the incentive or the bandwidth to
give you much time until like you say
until you prove yourself yeah got it
so unfold oh can you tell me about like
the origin of on folio you mentioned you
had the idea and then you know were
growing human proof and then it sort of
came back to you so how did you get from
you know there to where you are now yeah
I actually remember I don't remember
what year was I think it was probably
2014 and I was I was at lunch with my my
wife back then she was
my girlfriend and I remember saying to
her like I saw them at human proof or
something and I was like yeah I had
another business idea today I think a
really cool business would be like I
know how to buy a website of Empire
flippers and grow it but I don't have
like $30,000 spare but other people have
$30,000 spare but they don't have a
growing website so wouldn't it be really
cool if though if I could partner with
people like that and and she was like oh
can of like real estate or stockbroker
that kind of thing and I was like yeah
you should do my marketing I was like
yeah exactly but the problem is I'm just
some dude in Taiwan like I barely
full-time and my own business and like I
don't have a track record or a team or
Authority or any of those things that
you need but maybe one day I will
and then yeah that was the end of that
idea and then 2018 I did a deep dive
survey to the human group design
audience which is from the ask method by
Ryan Levesque and basically I was just
surveying the audience and I was asking
them what their biggest problems were
and one or two people mentioned they had
money to buy websites like like big
websites not like them for you ones but
they didn't know where to buy them or
what to do with them once they bought
them like I think three or four people
mentioned it out of a couple hundred
which is that's actually high enough to
continue this conversation so I emailed
a few people it was like so do you think
a course on website investing would be
good or do you think a service and some
of them were like yeah of course would
be good someone like a service would be
good and then so I actually built a
course and while promoting the course
even more people were like you know a
service would be good and I was like I
know I'm just trying to promote the
course first and then I was like wait a
second I had this idea before like four
years ago but now I am an authority I do
have a track record I do have experience
I
do you have a team interesting and I
also think the market now is more mature
there's more there's better websites for
sale like you know no offense to their
my flipper sites in 2014 but the ones
for sale now away better they're a lot
bigger you know there are sites on the
market right now on like five million
dollars two million dollars eight
hundred thousand dollars that are like
still just content websites and there's
more serious money moving in but there's
still a lack of like professional sort
of managers there's there's there's more
and more people coming to the same
conclusions that I'm coming to you and
the more I talk about it the more other
people will enter the space so you know
if they haven't built a service business
before calculating how to do that but
yeah so I just kind of felt like I got
the validation I realized like I had all
the answers this time whereas I didn't
four or five years ago and I just
started talking about it a little bit
and people were like yeah I've been
looking for this kind of business for a
long time so suddenly like we've got
like 30 sites that we're running and
it's like oh okay I guess this is a good
idea so that's kind of it's just it's
like for me it's a great story but for a
beginner listening to this or someone
who's trying to find their way they
might be like oh yeah that's great for
you because you already had an audience
and you already you were able to
leverage your network and so on and like
yeah I can't really deny that so I think
it's just a case of understanding maybe
your market and looking for a gap or a
need and I think that is why I keep
falling into service businesses because
I keep seeing these needs out there and
not being afraid to run our service to
fulfill that need
and I guess my advice to anyone who
would is a beginner like that would be
to just the more experience you get in
your niche the more your the sooner
you'll be in that kind of situation that
I was in because it is just a kind of
case of like what do they say like you
have to work for 10,000 hours to get
overnight success or something like that
and I didn't know if I'm third you will
be classed as an overnight success but
it definitely feels like a case of it's
very easy right now because of what I've
done before so you know people just have
to do that before a bit to get to to
this kind of position interesting one I
mean you you started with no audience
and no credibility and you built it over
time so yeah like you said it's a eight
year overnight success or something like
that but you know when you look at it
though it's really on folio is a bit of
an extension you know another service
business it's not like you've switched
business models completely is just like
higher stakes higher investment value
but it's the same concepts overall so
very cool very cool yeah that's true
yeah so from a like services that on
folio provides so can you kind of
outline like what the process is like if
someone's interested in investing maybe
it's like a private investment group
maybe a family family trust or something
like that like what happens yeah so
we've got three services really well
we've we've got three but we've got two
because no one's ever used one of them
someone suggested it to me and I was is
a good idea
no one's ever run for it so one service
is actually kind of we partner with
people who already have sites and
they're whether they built that site
from scratch or they bought it we
partner up and we generally people come
to us for two reasons
like one is because they just don't know
how to grow the site anymore or they
don't have the capacity like maybe they
have a full-time job
they're like I know what I need to do to
get this to the next stage but I don't
have the time
others just don't know what they need to
do or it's people that just don't have
the bandwidth or the desire to run a
science anymore
like we run a couple of sites for a
Chapman who he has a huge portfolio
websites and he's just like okay can you
guys just run these for us
and then there's yes so there's like
those people those sites we don't just
take like smaller sites because it's not
really worth our time and we can you
know we want the site to be established
so that we can turn the dials and makes
that happen and then the other service
is similar but it's like someone has
money they want to get started but they
don't know how to run a site so they'll
they'll buy the site and we'll run it
for them and we'll help them find the
site we'll do the due diligence we'll
hop on a call with the seller and do all
of that stuff and then they own the
asset that will in exchange for a
management fee and a share of anything
we can grow we will run the site for
them and again for that one like we have
a minimum which is $50,000 because
anything below that there's not really
enough profit in the site for us to make
for us to take a management fee and then
for there to be a budget for growing the
site and the investor to get ROI so like
the bigger the amount of money the the
bigger it is River the other service
which no one uses is just like something
kind of in between it's like you want to
buy a site and you want to run it
yourself but you don't want to buy a
scam we'll just do the due diligence for
you okay no once no one is interested
they either they you don't want us to
run it over there they're fine and then
one thing we are looking at doing is
kind of a like a group by type thing
where it's like like we really want to
move up the food chain because when you
buy a site that is say 500k
it's got way more profit and it's piano
generally it has a team already like bas
and everything included content costs
already included usually so it's got the
growth budget like baked in and also
it's a much higher quality site and we
can run fewer of them like we could run
5 500k sites and made a very nice
management fee to be worth our time and
grow those sites but we don't need to
hire like 50 we don't need to buy 50
sites to pay for our overheads because
50 sites you can't really focus on them
so what we're thinking of doing is like
maybe someone any has 30 K or someone
has 100 K but they don't want to just
buy one single site with it so we'll
probably like what we think about doing
is like every quarter basically pooling
the people with money together and make
a JV and then you know setting it up as
like a legal entity and and just buying
like one site with it and so that's more
like a kind of like a real estate
investment type thing like the way that
works and then we'll just run it and
predetermine whether we're gonna do it
the cash flow or like to sell it in two
years or something like that so that's
that's the service which was attracted
the most attention I thought it would be
the partnership but generally people
that already have sites they're less
willing to give away some of the share
which which is understandable whereas
other people are like yeah I just I have
money I just want to invest and I want
but I you know I don't want to I wanna
buy a site and have it go to zero right
so it's yeah so that's that's the area
that we're most excited about and where
we can offer the most value as well
gotcha and you know that the service the
vetting service that I mean totally
makes sense to me in fact people have
hired me to vet sites ahead of time so I
bet it's just a matter of time before
that's like one of the more popular
services because you know what whatever
it is that you charge is going to be a
bargain versus like buying a site that
you know is somehow scammy or they're
something that they didn't know to look
for
as an issue so I think it's all a man
yeah time yeah I think like even if we
charged light like if someone's gonna
buy a site for say 60 grand we could
charge like 10 grand and it would still
be a good deal for them but we would
probably charge a lot less than that but
there are companies out there that do
that already as well so like century ago
for example so we're not like that's
that's a good one-time payment to bring
in some money for us but it's like not
really the kind of long-term planning
that I see on folio succeeding with so
sure I'm not too fast about the success
of that one in its one my head I'm like
well it's a great you know once you get
them in the door and show the value you
can you know upsell them on the
management of stuff unless they just
happen to be you know I would imagine a
person that would hire for a vetting
service doesn't necessarily have the
skills to grow it so maybe it's a lead
magnet kind or not a lead magnet but a
tripwire situation into the big I don't
know we're just I'm just speculating
here but yeah maybe I actually just do
the betting like $100 or something I was
like just get in the door yeah
interesting
yeah can you I'm sorry to interrupt you
there were you done with your thought no
I was just myself so it's cool so I
don't know like how much you can reveal
but like what's the general process so
let's say someone comes in like ace for
example who has like a site that's doing
well
obviously you're incentivized I believe
to you know grow the site right like you
want to grow it you get paid more so
everybody has the same incentive they
want to you know and increase the
revenue so can you take us through just
some of the basic things that the team
does to grow the site yeah so every site
is different but generally we start out
in the same place and most sites that
we've partnered on have had some
some level of technical SEO issue
pretty much everyone we've been like
well the first thing we're going to do
is fix that and that that issue might be
as basic as like not having an SSL
certificate installed too sometimes we
get people that haven't fixed the ghost
you know the great ghost error of 2018
just where a bunch of their stuff good
index they shouldn't some of them have
architecture issues so just like
navigation and site structure and things
like that pretty much every single one
has speed issues generally if someone
knows how to get their speed good then
they don't need our service so we
normally will fix all them first then
there's a lot of CRA type stuff like
most people like if it's an Amazon site
they don't really have mobile optimized
tables I'm sure Matthew Allen would have
something to say about that with this
plugin but yeah a lot of them a lot of
mobile-friendly tables or
mobile-friendly they're so
mobile-friendly that and from there it's
very much a bespoke plan like some of
them it's like right now we're just
going to smash the site with the content
until until all that site scales other
sites it's like we need to disavow your
spammy backlinks other sites it's like
oh you've got an info product funnel
let's try doubling the pricing on that
and that kind of thing so yeah it really
it's always the same we do a technical
audit a speed order and the kind of
keyword and backing called it and based
on that we usually have something to
improve and sometimes that can be enough
to turn the site around as well they're
not always like distressed sites when
they come to us but yeah quite often
they it can turn them around but then
from there it really varies like what
we're gonna do next
very very interesting yeah I could
definitely imagine some people have
sites where there's a ton of content
almost no backlinks or vice versa where
there's
you know 50 posts but a crazy amount of
backlinks and there's opportunities to
like fill the gaps wherever they happen
to be interesting so with the sounds
like a lot of work needs to be done for
any of the sites so tell me about the
team that you have now or sort of how
that structured I know but actually I'll
just leave it at that it won't speculate
so what's the team like how do you run
that fortunately I had a very good
project manager recently so things have
been a lot more smooth over the last
couple of months but essentially there
was like there's not actually that many
of us like on the actual sort of core
team there's probably about 10 and that
will range from like me who's you know
like the boss and then Alejandro who
does a lot of the he does all of the
audits and a lot of he's kind of an
extension of me in the way that he'll do
a lot of the game plans for the sites
and deciding what we're going to do but
there he's also strong in other areas
he's a lot better at technical SEO than
I am so he knows all about all of the
audits and then we have the program at
Osby and then she's just like making
sure we're all doing stuff it's just
like you know whenever my asana queue
gets to zero suddenly it's back to ten
again aha
and then we have just various
freelancers below that and people who
are full-time who like we have some work
wood Hannah who's really good at
Pinterest and so she runs runs that side
of thing we've got a lot of sites that
do well with the kind of Pinterest and
media vine model so there's a lot of
people like in affiliate marketing who
are really focused on like SEO and best
blah blah blah and then there's loads
and loads of people mostly work at home
moms but not there's a lot of others in
the group as well so we're just like
silently crushing it with Pinterest and
media and making like 5k a month 10k a
month is crazy
so yeah Pinterest is a big part of what
we do I know we just have like sort of
bas below that who you know like they do
content uploading and audience and on
page SEO tweaks and all of that stuff
yeah and then we bring in you know if we
need content written we use an agency or
use smoke humor with designs articles
and SEO like authority builders and
maybe some other more great how ones
depending on it it's like our site or
not so yeah things are interesting okay
in like when you branched out to like
work on on folio and I guess slowly were
deciding to you know make it your main
focus like how did you I guess determine
what success was how do you know you're
on the right track
sounds like you know you have quite a
few sites that you're managing now but
how did you project what you wanted to
do over six 12 18 months knowing that
you were gonna be working on a full-time
I guessed I kind of I had that initial
validation early on like I mentioned and
from there it was like I guess I was in
a situation where I was like all I need
to do is get enough customers and at
least this is how I rationalized it in
my head I was like if I can just have
say ten clients or partners I don't
really think of them as clients ten
partners around that number that would
be enough to pay for my team's overheads
and then my team can work on my own
sites for free so therefore because
sometimes I would have this thought like
why do I need to bother why don't I just
have five of my own sites maybe make 20k
a month of those five which is very easy
to do or even 30km
of just those five sites and just work
on the five sites myself and have no
team or even just on one site you know
in doing 15k that would that would keep
me happy and then it was like well I
kind of want a diversification and I
want to move up the food chain as I
talked about I didn't want to just be
having to do all the work myself I
didn't want to be reliant on my own
businesses as well so it was for me it
was about de-risking my own stuff and
also I was like yeah so I'm pretty sure
run folios going to be a good idea but
worst case scenario as long as it can
just pay my bills then the money I make
from my own sites it's kind of like free
money but then when I started talking
about it like to Fe International and
Empire flippers and within the rhodium
Facebook group I don't know if you're
aware there was a lot of people saying
that's a great idea lots of people need
that and so before before and maybe
people started coming in I got a lot of
people telling me it was a good idea
which doesn't necessarily mean it is a
good idea but it gave me enough
confidence to keep going and now we get
like one or two people messaging us a
day talking about like the possibilities
of working together so yeah to the
extent where I never even bothered
creating a sales page for the service I
was like just contact us here and then
people started messaging me and I was
online earning,make money online, earn money online, online earning, online earning sites,
make money online free, online money income, earn money online free, money online, best way to earn money online, online income site, money earning websites, best online earning sites, easiest way to earn money online, earn money payment bkash, online money income site
Posts
No comments:
Post a Comment