hey what's going on it's Doug Pennington
here and in this video Chris Pearson and
I tear down several big blogs so we're
looking at smart passive income by Pat
Flynn a huge fan of his we look at
repeat safeties I will teach you to be
rich we look at marieforleo.com so
buckle up we don't hold anything back
and we go through like the pros and cons
for each of the sites in a lot of cases
I could tell you the load time and the
amount of you know garbage that is on a
site especially the home page it seems
to be excessive so you'll see that as
like an ongoing theme and it's really
interesting to see the progression and
the different like some similarities
that you see between these different
home pages if you do not know Chris
Pearson he is the founder of DIY themes
all-around badass I would say he's very
smart I'm lucky to have gone through
this tear down process with him so grab
yourself a coffee or whatever your
beverage of choice is and check out
these tear downs hey what's going on
it's Doug Huntington here from niche
site project and we have my friend Chris
Pearson how are you today yes what's up
doing great gonna be here again awesome
awesome and you're from DIY themes
thesis and the focus WordPress theme so
any other like quick intro stuff oh you
just better hope your page doesn't come
into my crosshairs because I'm gonna
blow it up let's do it we'll do the
homepage first and I actually I hopped
over here because at one point well I
got my hole will start from smart
passive income I found pads podcasts and
I was like this is just fantastic so I
dove in headfirst and every now and then
like any good artist I guess I would go
to my influence and then I would try and
copy all their stuff all right
absolutely so I was like he must have
some stuff going on but I went back the
other day and I was like there are so
many options here I'm confused there's a
few green buttons there's a few green
things and I just don't know what to do
so Chris what do you see and how do you
evaluate this
first thing I see when I'm looking at
your site or when I'm looking at your
screen pardon uh it looks like the nav
menu is a bit wide and not really
start here you've got a click overlay
where that is overlaying the logo the
license plate logo there and that's
gonna create an overlapping click area
which is definitely not ideal it's not
the end of the world but it is an
indication that that was designed for a
very specific context possibly and isn't
super fluid in terms of the way it
adapts to different screen sizes that's
a common thing you're gonna run into if
you have a lot of items in the
navigation menu the question becomes how
do I handle this at different screen
sizes and what adjustments are going to
be necessary you know this is not really
related to a landing page but it sort of
is because this ends up becoming a
cascading thing that affects everything
else in your page but I have been huge
on navigation menus here lately honestly
this has been my topic of the summer of
2019 and so what happens if situation
like this is if you have a lot of
navigation menu items like I said you
have to figure out how to accommodate
them in these different views but what
happens what we the typical approach has
been to just shrink it all into a
hamburger menu that's revealed by click
as devices get smaller couple problems
with this approach problem number one
the navigation menu requires more
resources to be hidden behind a click
into CSS resources possibly the use of
JavaScript there's ways to do it without
JavaScript but almost every
implementation you've ever seen is going
to involve JavaScript and the the menu
is presented differently in different
screen contexts so for example on a very
small mobile handheld device it's gonna
be a vertically oriented menu hidden
behind a click we'll go into that a
little bit this is gonna be a pervasive
theme through this little talk about
stuff being hidden behind a clique and
how that's no good but second secondary
to that you have a vertical presentation
in one format and a horizontal
presentation in another let's say a
visitor is standing in line at Chipotle
they read a tweet they go to your site
they are
collecting visual cues and things to
fall back on the next time they visit
your site well if the next time they
visit your sites on desktop and nothing
looks the freaking same they're not
going to be able to find their markers
so there waive their ability to do
wayfinding to perform navigation
self-guided navigation is massively
massively affected by that and actually
it looks to me like the links are not
exactly the same between the two there
are actually different links in the
different menus so that creates a bunch
of HTML CSS and JavaScript largess more
than needs to be there that slows down
your pages and then you have this
differing scenario that creates
usability problems and it's a bad way to
do it it is the way we have done it
since 2011 it is a bad way to do it we
need to stop this because that practice
does not translate it doesn't provide
any sort of navigational crossover
between the various devices that people
might access your site from so that's
first thing that stands out to me and
like I said even the execution of it in
this case is not particularly good
because like I said that that those
links are kind of shifting mm-hmm okay
um I would love to see I know Pat has
very very good opt-in numbers but you
know when analyzing stuff like this you
can't just say oh well Pat does this so
this will work for me Pat does a lot
Peck creates a brand it's like a like an
army that marches you know him through
his podcast you know him through the
imagery he's put out there you know him
through recommendations from others
people who say oh we love that and so
there is a lot to suggest listen to Pat
and so if he has a pop-up like this pop
up in the lower right corner it's gonna
work better for him than for you because
he has a reputation that precedes him
and a whole lot of momentum if you're
just a random nobody you do what Pat
does all you're doing is slowing down
your site and presenting a pop-up that's
gonna annoy the crap out of people yes a
hundred hundred percent I was gonna say
like this he's an exception case like in
in so many areas but yeah like if I
tried to do this stuff it just wouldn't
work out I mean not actually when I
landed on the page I was just like I
don't know where to go I don't know what
I don't know what to do but I think it
becomes
the challenge right for somebody like
Pat who like you said he has you know
speaking he has YouTube the podcast
that's huge the blog is huge so like how
can how can a person like that like
navigate like can you have one goal for
your homepage look for someone like Pat
uh for Pat definitely you don't want
just a single goal for the home page
okay well this is a great question I
honestly I'll go I'll break this down
every bit of it cuz I've been dealing
with this exact thing so number one know
if your Pat know but there are really
you know his challenge is how do I
present what I have in a very concise
way that is fast yet still gets me the
results I want so one of the situation
that he's gonna encounter in any
successful who anybody who's has a site
that's been successful over time so like
I said people want to join his list
through recommendations his reputation
precedes him so that's one action
definitely wants people to be able to
take on his homepage no more enjoying
the list number two list of the podcast
that might even be number one now he
probably gets most of his engagement
through his podcast which he's been
doing consistently forever
tons of listeners that's why he loves
the podcast widget on the bottom of the
homepage a lot of the stuff that's going
here this is not a fast web page this is
a slow clunky in my opinion crappy from
a technical standpoint web page but he's
he knows that people coming to engage
with the podcast he knows that people
are coming to engage with his income
reports and he knows that people are
coming to engage with his email list
which is why he is asking for those
things it's also why he has a
supplemental navigation bar for
affiliate marketing he knows that that's
smart passive income that's kind of
what's founded on the blogging thing the
email marketing the podcasting now I
look at this now I don't know what is
selling for him and what's getting his
traction and all that but I feel like
the better blogging probably should be
their email marketing probably shouldn't
be there in this manner the podcasting
you know I think I think this whole sub
navigation menu is just there because
it's like aw crap how do I present this
stuff I want it linked from the home
page let's just throw it on there here's
the situation he's getting into though
it's got two navigation menus I've
already explained how they don't display
the same between mobile and desktop
so you got that bad that's not great but
we also have a problem with user
psychology here user psychology says
that you cannot give users too many
options they're not going to take any as
a result not good
the only people are gonna be clicking on
stuff in this nav menu are people who
know exactly where they're going when
they get here they're not gonna read all
nine options at the top and not gonna
read the next five milli yeah which one
applies to me No their eyes are gonna go
right down to Pat's picture and the most
likely link that they're gonna click on
in this page right now is learn more or
the play button on the podcast at the
bottom I don't know his metrics but I
bet you anything that's true
I also think about in the navigation
menu is popular because about is popular
everywhere what's the number one thing
we want to do when we interface with the
machine we want to humanize the machine
about this how we do that so you know
and now so scroll down a little bit
let's go through this Pat's got a social
proof here as featured in I don't know
that Pat really needs to further
legitimize his stuff I think people
already get here and they already know
it's got another email opt-in there I
feel like that could probably be worked
in better especially since he's got the
pop-up in the lower right hand corner
it's just a bunch of resources for this
you can do it more simply this section
this section I think is worthless this
let's find out what works and these big
things with these icons first of all
people's interpretations of icons this
is by no means like Oh consistent
landscape everyone sees this stuff the
same way false you know the little
gender things on restroom signs are
about the only thing we can agree on as
a society I don't think we are agreeing
on those well you know these these take
up a lot of space they're presented
horizontally here they're gonna be
presented vertically on mobile creates a
completely different vibe this is not
the cheapest thing to convey within the
context of this design it just feels
like this a shoehorn in there to give
like a cool thing but all I look I look
at this something is it effective does
it slow down the page the page load time
does this stuff really need to be
presented contextually right here in
this way my answer now is probably not
and this will ring a bell with you give
them some of the stuff we've talked
about with focus recently and that is
instead of just this oh I have
all the stuff to offer let me throw all
this crap on my homepage no that doesn't
work it doesn't work it might satisfy
you because you're like oh I covered all
my bases the problem is nobody uses
those bases in that manner you need if
you want if you have a lot of deep
concepts that you want people to connect
to it the best you can do is introduce
them to the funnel on your site where
they can go deep on this concept but you
don't want to muddy up a homepage with
too much information about this stuff
Pat's probably got I would venture so
now he is he has a huge breadth of work
he has accomplished a ton over the past
decade on the Internet he has a ton of
content ton of value there's no doubt
about that his job and what makes this
tough is he's got identified the three
or four things that are really gonna
appeal to people and he means to build
his homepage around that like these
recent posts absolute joke should not be
here should only be on the blog page not
here there's no point to having them
here at all all it's doing is massively
increasing the page load time also
massively increasing the total number of
requests necessary to serve this page
not good not good let's keep going all
right trusted resources that generates
money for him I think there's a better
way to do that it could be Pat's
recommendations just a special page and
that page would be worth so much money
it would be stupid again yeah he has it
on the resources but yet to have it on
the home page is like too much kind of
like what you're saying there's just too
many options it's just there's too much
here to consume you can't even I might
take away from this homepage as well it
seems like Pat's important but I didn't
take any action I clicked away went back
to it yeah right right and I think like
you hit a key point it and for me
personally like I don't have like a ton
of people landing on my homepage usually
they're hitting like an inner page
because they googled something and then
at that point they're hopefully in the
final now that we've worked together a
little bit and got like a little more
focus on the site on my site personally
but you know in that way it's reducing
the options where someone's hitting the
some inner funnel area and then there's
sort of like in that silo of that funnel
so yes yes all right
any anything else on this page like I
guess overall you were like there's kind
of a lot of options resource heavy but
pad is someone who does need to give
someone options to get them in the right
place so I need sort of like top top
recommendations like the number one
thing you would you're like hey we gotta
clean this part not yeah yeah the min
the menu options are just a disaster he
needs to get that down to three or four
I recommend four start here the start
here page could actually cover most of
the crap that the home page covers I
think I think oh people come to his home
page they're gonna want to see how do I
get to the podcast because I just know
that's number one concern for him he
wants people on his list he can have a
big splash thing like he has here to
encourage people to sign up to the list
I do not think it needs to take up the
whole page and be this big of an hero
sort of splash so what we call these
elements that just take up the whole
page to dominate the page I've come to
be known as a hero type elements and
really this is associated with a full
image with an overlay but that's that's
a little bit too nuanced for me it's
just a big damn thing that takes a bold
page that's a hero presentation the
problem with those is they don't
translate well to mobile devices
something that's very big on desktop
actually gets pretty small a small short
rectangle on a mobile device does not
have nearly the same effect I recommend
I it's not necessary to use all the
space for one thing it just isn't you
can use the same amount of space for the
two or three things that are super
important to people and he could already
have you know people engaging with that
without needing to scroll down through
stuff without needing to go through a
bunch of self-aggrandizing things he
doesn't need to do that anymore that's
the beauty of being established and
awesome you don't have to waste time and
resources on puffing yourself up he's
done he could have a you know a
citations page or something like that
hey look at all these places where I've
been featured you know I've been
featured everywhere and the page is ten
miles long so there's just other ways to
remix content and to send people down
that particular information funnel hey
Pat has cred go down this funnel hey Pat
has podcast code on this one hey Pat has
an email list with all these affiliate
marketing stuff I know that's kind of
intertwined he could he could
get people engaging with him kind of
lead them through the path of engagement
hey listen when my podcast join this
email list you'll learn about this type
of affiliate marketing you know it's a
establishing a process flow rather than
just vomiting all of your credentials
and resources upon people at one time
processes not options options equals
people leave and just for a tip for
anyone who's gonna like thinking about
this and kind of analyzing their own
site we are too married to the way we
think our sites are performing right now
I promise you no matter what you who you
are what you do what your proposals are
you can streamline and get better
engagement by reducing the amount of
crap that people have to go through
period full stop
this effect is applies to everyone
doesn't matter who you are streamlining
information flows produces better
engagement and better results awesome
let's move on to the next one so another
I'm a fanboy for all these things we're
looking looking at here today so I will
teach you to be rich or meet safety and
yeah kind of some similar stuff going on
but yes so this is great I actually love
that we see some similarities because
these are designed trends these are
trends and these are designers and
website owners looking around the
internet saying oh we see this happening
I want to do this too trends are the
worst damn thing you can possibly do
because almost every trend hinges on
some measure of convenience or ego ego
is something that the site owner the
website owner you whoever we're talking
to here what's to do for you you look
better this seems strong this seems like
a good proposal this looks good
the problem is that's all you what you
think only thing that matters to your
visitors is what they think and what
visitors want is stuff to load quickly
when visitors come to your website they
do so on a promise now 10 years ago we
went to websites because it was cool to
browse websites unfortunately nobody
browses websites anymore we browse
social media feeds and we click through
to specific pages not necessarily home
pages whenever we see something that
looks important to us we click through
on a promise something we can expect to
find when we land on the
destination website if that site doesn't
deliver on exactly that message
you know I click through for tips on you
know saving money or whatever and I
don't see that here I'm not gonna take a
quiz I'm not gonna look at your nap menu
I'm just gonna leave I came on a promise
you didn't deliver I'm out that's the
way the internet works now we have to
understand this social media feeds are
so addictive and so dopamine rich that
when people click through if they're not
satisfied immediately they're gone
they're gonna jump right back to the
social media feed and look for things
that you know continue to give them that
dopamine fix if you deliver on the
promise that sent people to your website
you reinforce that dopamine feedback
loop then you can get them you have
captured their attention but their
attentions fragile and if they come to
your site and you do not capture you
don't understand the transaction that's
occurring you will lose and so these
hero approaches this is a stab right
here I love this this quiz this quiz is
a stab at engagement but this is
something they're testing I'm sure and
it's getting some engagement but who
knows how people are being driven what
promise people are being driven to his
homepage with I feel like this is
probably people that hit click start the
quiz probably taking random actions
because they just know that repeats is
someone important that they should be
following and they come to the site
they're kind of just farting around
which is a small percentage of visitors
to by the way but then they come here
and they just engage with this cause
really nothing else to do I would argue
that Ramin has put enough value out
there free and paid that he does not
need to do his homepage in this manner
he could establish an engagement funnel
that works better than this and that
also sells what he has better than this
but I do like that at least at least
this is the only option people have now
whether or not this is the best option
for them to engage with I I can't answer
that I don't I don't have access to his
site metrics or what his current goals
are but you know and the rest of this
stuff
yeah the social proof I don't care what
you'll get
what you'll get with what what are we
getting you just asked me to take a quiz
and now I don't even know we like this
how is this germane right now I don't
see how this matters at all yeah it's
not no continuity with with that no and
he now he's got another call to action
for the quiz boy they're really pushing
this quiz I'd like to know why why
should I take this quiz what is this
gonna get me to do I came here your your
I will teach you to be rich guy I want
some tips like what can you not present
this in this manner do you not know the
six things that people look for when
they come to your site like Romina has
data he knows these things I think this
is a bad homepage right now what's
beneath that last call to action nothing
there's nothing you know he's living an
engagement so he's gonna get engaged on
with the quiz this will work to satisfy
that need
it could work even better if he's gonna
do this just freakin get rid of the nav
menu and all this other just get
rid of it I was gonna say I haven't I've
done this on my home page where I've
removed most of the options you know nav
menu at the top it's at the bottom and
you only have like maybe about and block
like those are the only two options
right so would you so you're like get
rid of the nav menu maybe put it at the
bottom something like that
there's just no informational process
flow that tells me why I should click on
anything here there's literally nothing
and there's no promise for the quiz
yeah it looks to me like in that section
below that I said was useless it looks
like you might get some stuff after you
take the quiz like a white paper or
something actionable if so he needs to
say that up at the top not this what
you'll get well he'll get with what you
take the quiz and then you'll realize
you don't make enough money I think
that's I know he's not gonna tell me to
save five bucks on lattes which is great
but what lets you know your prepaid I
guess the other thing to note is like
we're picking folks that are well
established again like meat has a book a
new addition out to his book could check
out his books good book you know but
it's like these fantastic advice I
definitely recommend you know his stuff
but it's home pages garbage okay it
loaded pretty fast from what I can see
but I'm on a high gigabit situation they
made some they've made some decent
optimizations it's not great smart
passive income they did the best they
could boy that thing is a is a huge
dinosaur but they babe
three point five three eight seconds to
document complete on papal insight the
page is one point two nine megabytes
that's huge
contrast that with the DIY themes home
page which i think is something like you
know 200 kilobytes so you know one-sixth
the size and Pat's site has 56 requests
for document complete that is just a
boatload of requests but like I said
they've done the best they could trying
to fit all that crap in there and still
have it load fast I'm gonna while we're
talking here I'll run a test on Ramin
site and we'll get a little bit more
concrete data but yeah the hero thing
it's just a way it doesn't translate
between different devices or vertically
oriented device or horizontally oriented
device zero translation there it loses
effect this promise on his home page
he's probably looking that number saying
oh the quiz is getting good engagement
well that's because your nav menu is
boring there's nothing to tell me how to
and this is the only option you've given
people even if the other flows on the
page don't make any sense anecdote on
DIY themes calm I got rid of all pretty
much all options to link and go places I
still have a navigation menu in my
footer since I changed my navigation
structure on July 6 of this summer my
engagement with the links in my footer
has gone way way up there's a reason why
this is the case people now go all the
way through my pages they get down all
the way through the content which they
didn't do as much before so now they're
all the way to the bottom of the content
they go what the hell do I do now
they're mindlessly clicking on crap and
that bottom menu my privacy policy page
has got more visits as July 6 then it
got in the previous 10 years yeah when
you were only you were redesigning stuff
I was like weird like what am I look
looking for so yeah I was like trying to
find stuff and just clicking around so I
probably was like a couple dozen of
those yeah well you know it works an in
quick note is we're just waiting for
some of those results like I've
purchased a few of roommate's
courses some of the more expensive ones
I never took the quiz quiz like I I went
elsewhere I think this is interesting
I'm sure he knows but like we know from
my telemarketer data and from other your
brand data that people are very reticent
to take quizzes unless you get you know
offer a freebie so I think I find this
hot I find this whole presentation odd
and I think to like I said I would side
with Pat Flynn site it's true over meet
site as well when you are a big presence
you have books you have videos you do
interviews you know he's got he's
probably gonna get 500 visitors today
through an interview he did with Tim
Ferriss years ago okay but like so he's
got all these dreams just leading people
to his site with an idea about what they
can expect the way this is gonna work
for him it's gonna be better than it
will work for you because of this and
I'm saying it's not even working that
well for him
and he's got no way to look at clean
data now because Remi can tell hey take
action and he's gonna get a much higher
percentage of respondents taking action
because he's Ramin Sethi he's viewed as
being authoritative
so it's hard to unravel this stuff once
you get to it but it's really all about
understanding how attention works and if
you give people a chance to click on
random crap they will they will do that
that gets them into a mindset I call
aimless browsing aimless proud browsing
does not produce money for you doesn't
produce opt-ins doesn't produce leads
doesn't produce engagement does not
produce money you don't want people
browsing aimlessly on your website you
might have in 2009 so you had good
metrics but they don't matter that
doesn't convert it doesn't matter okay
Ramiz site loads in five point seven two
seconds document complete that page size
that tiny home page which is much
smaller than path wins much smaller
doesn't do I mean we went through it it
doesn't do anything Ramiz page two point
eight two megabytes for what it's all
those uh this huge image here or
something and here's really good skin it
looks like thick hair like you Chris
yeah maybe he wanted that that really
high-resolution so he looks as good as
possible
listen I just did a big image on a
little little project I just took on
over the weekend and optimizing image
was a huge huge deal I had an image that
started off at about six hundred
kilobytes and I squished that effort
down to about fifty nine kilobytes for a
production use on the website this is
what you have to do and you know speed
performance accessibility and all
devices you're in line at Chipotle
looking this up on your phone after you
click through from a tweet or the
garbage 4G connection with one bar you
don't have time to load roommates
beautiful face
you just don't know no do you did
Chipotle a lot all the time big fan yeah
what's your go-to what's your go-to
order okay
it's a bowl no rice very easy on the
black beans add veggies hopefully more
onions and anything else for
anti-inflammatory qualities
barbacoa a little more than just your
regular scoop I know what they do in
training I don't care one more Pico hot
cheese Glock perfection that sounds
awesome I may go there later today after
or you must be a spokesperson for them
or something so I should be I guarantee
it in my head since the year 2000 I have
eaten more fresh Macs
between Qdoba is another one in Chipotle
since the year 2000 I've eaten more of
that than anyone on the planet
I guarantee it IRA Qdoba had a customer
loyalty program where every 10 visits
you got a free burrito and they they
used to do punch cards well once they
switched to like a credit card style
I had redeemed a hundred and ten free
burritos on the card
this was after I'd gone through many
punch cards on that so that suggests
eleven hundred burritos and then I had
another card with about a hundred so I
had redeemed like two hundred and ten
free ones which is a good-ass over two
thousand burrito purchases and not only
that I don't used to receive free ones
all the time cuz I went all the time so
I knew all the staff that like here note
me no you don't you know that kind of
thing so you start adding that up it's
like my god man how much did you eat
there yeah yeah that's great it will in
your in Ostend you have many choices for
great fresh tex-mex kind of stuff right
so oh yeah I'm not gonna turn into
tex-mex when I'm like sixty site also
forty five requests very very slow no
reason for it to be slow just brutal
that's a terrible homepage home pages
need to be fast need to be to the point
this one is not he might say oh the quiz
is what I want to satisfy right now okay
great you win the argument I leave and
what let's move on to Marie Forleo here
so I mean I'm not sure if I'm at the top
I'm gonna reload this just so we get the
fresh yeah I think that was the exit
intent popover oh boy oh boy alright
there we go oh my god so big hero
animated in this case yeah oh wow I see
stuff like this here's the thing Marie's
like for me and she's like Pat everyone
knows who Marie is it when loves Marie
Marie is one of the most loved people
that I'm aware of and she was need to do
this she's thinking of moving Marie and
her home page what is this dude does
that sell better all that does is take
longer to load it does nothing for her
she looks great even if she's not moving
she doesn't need to be moving
I look at this and I think the best that
the book is here thing at the top in
pink probably gets all the engagement
I bet the about link gets a little bit
of engagement and I bet people kind of
scroll through this and kind of watch
the page I bet you've got if you did eye
tracking you would see that people kind
of do this stuff's have a okay probably
not clicking that keep going
still scrolling people scrolling fast
yeah now just skip that that's not
relevant right now you know what that is
no that's not a variant like how is that
connected like I can see shows so this
is a white paper that she wants people
to get but it's kind of presented in the
flow where it's disjointed it's not
compelling in this context it might be
compelling standalone if that was like a
featured box at the top of the homepage
instead of her picture which is useless
it would probably get great engagement
and drive exactly the kind of you know
you get people into your funnel see
here's the thing here's the thing any of
these big personalities they have quite
a few concepts that their audience has
latched onto and found helpful over the
years I have quite a few threads of
thought that are like their main sort of
intellectual assets you want to get
people engaging with these but they're
gonna pick the one that had or one or
more that has the flavor that they're
looking for question is how do you do
this
well you I've learned recently I really
started to come to grips with this
reality is that you cannot do it in one
visit it is not how it occurs that's how
we treat the website now we're like oh
we need to be exhaustive on this one
visit no no no no no real engagement
happens on between three and five visits
this is a crazy thing to realize so you
have to understand all you can do is get
a hook on visit one visit one hook visit
to piqued interest the second
interaction somebody has with you you
want you want to get them thinking you
want to get them thinking about
something that is like your intellectual
output or maybe a product that you have
thinking about some asset that you have
on the third then you're trying to
convince to buy that's the persuasion
the deep persuasion when you want to
undertake that but that's the third
visit the third interact
I know from customer data historical
data on DIY themes people don't buy till
the third or fourth visit it's just the
way it is yet I have for years tried to
vomit out everything on them in the
first visit it's just not effective
right and that's sort of what's
happening here
Marie needs to scrap all this scrap her
image scrap that one call-to-action at
the top to get hurt get people into the
funnel get them involved and then then
present them with maybe three things
that might be of interest and then
getting picking these funnels going
deeper and deeper into her little
intellectual domain here that is how you
achieve engagement that's how you drive
this stuff effectively not this what is
this Marie doesn't need social proof
people seen her on Oprah
more animation yes with the TV no one
cares Murray it doesn't matter right now
get them into your main page
get them on an opt-in send them to a
page like hey this is all my cool stuff
I got this TV thing you can learn about
these concepts here I've got this this
white paper do this and then you can get
these results
you know it'll cause an effect sequence
after someone's already taken an action
to indicate that they are interested in
what you may the concepts that you may
be talking about then they're primed to
take an action right now a Visser comes
here they're not prime to take any
action now seeing all this dispara stuff
I don't see how this fits together
Murray looks important
maybe I'll follow her on Twitter close
window with Oprah yeah
Branson they come up yeah Tony Robbins
she's standing on a on a step there he's
on his uh he's on his knees yeah all
right okay so the pretty a lot of stuff
going on simpler menu so I'll mention
that there's a simpler menu here's a
simpler I think it's probably more
effective click on that more link let's
see what that does
yeah
just honestly what you see in this
pop-up should probably be her homepage I
swear to God I am not kidding that would
be a better homepage just what you see
on that pop-up menu that'd be a way
better on page got it all right so for
contrast and I guess a place where we
you can reveal some data Chris we can go
to DIY themes where you have recently
sort of simplified a lot of things and
we should look at yours too by the way
anyway yeah so this is a DIY themes
homepage so the biggest thing I've done
recently and we talked about this is the
navigation okay so I do have a menu here
at the top it's very simple it's very
simple I know the queries that bring
people to my site it's for the new focus
WordPress theme old stuff about thesis
which is still relevant and then I've
got a new blog with some content about
you know modern performance techniques
things to do to make WordPress websites
faster that sort of thing you're not
gonna log in for existing customers
because that's a convenience thing for
them but let's click on click on focus
okay now we have a breadcrumb trail at
the top breadcrumb trails are not
options in the same way that navigation
menus are options breadcrumb trails
describe a pathway a linear pathway
linear pathways are like the most
fundamental thing humans use for finding
for wayfinding for navigation it's like
a path a trail in the park you can't
screw this up you just stay on the trail
and eventually you'll get where you want
to go that's what a breadcrumb trail is
all about this introduces zero cognitive
load a user looks at this understands
what it is doesn't think about it
anymore
they just know it's a security blanket
hey if I want to go back I can just do
this then then they're not thinking
about that also I talked about funneling
you want you don't want to just vomit
everything on people at once I don't
want to link to focus documentation and
pricing on the homepage you're either
here to look at focus or you're not if
you are you clicked on focus or read the
copy and clicked on it through there got
there you know got there through
different route same same result now on
this page that stuff is relevant you
might want to look at focus
documentation especially if you're an
existing user and you might want to look
at pricing if you don't currently have
the software these are the what's the
number one question people have is there
more information what's the price so I
have I'm only showing these options
within this particular funnel because I
know you're here for focus this is now
what's relevant to you and you'll notice
there's only two options that's not
asking too much of you if you want to
make this decision I'm confident you'll
be able to do so okay quick interruption
so just to restate so when someone's on
this page this is the menu that they
have this menu doesn't show up in other
places right that is correct
got it and then if we scroll down a
little bit this this just deep dives
into focus stuff there's no sidebar
there's no other stuff to do it's just
you go through this you learn more about
this product I want people learning
about this thing on this page that's the
only thing that
you know that's sealing that that's what
will lead to you either get connect with
this or and if you don't connect with it
you you'll leave and that's fine I don't
have to capture anything I don't have to
ask you for your email address this
isn't gonna work for you and you're
gonna be interested in go farther or not
and that's fine and I don't need to
badger you let's try to get you on a
list or do an exit intent pop-up because
you suddenly scrolled back up and that
indicates you might want to leave and I
desperately want to get you on the list
cuz I might not make this sale no those
are desperate crappy tactics that also
slow down your pages they don't look
desperate
you know pathetic oh I see we have a
link here so this dives down into some
documentation so your truck you're given
a little how-to and you're hoping people
will think hey I like that
I want to like do a little more so yeah
go go ahead yeah this interesting thing
I this actually a test that linked the
presence of that link so I've presented
quite a few videos here I don't even
talk about all the aspects of focus or
do the normal theme thing like show the
27 critical features that people are
looking for this is just stupid I'd
rather people watch me demonstrate the
software in these videos and so I have a
really persuasive video that actually
it's a long video that's why that's why
I've linked it to a separate page here
to kind of see if people will go to that
and then take action it is having that
effect but you know that page if you you
learn how to create rich engaging pages
with focus and people watch that whole
video they will buy the product so I
definitely want to link to that because
I know it's potent video but I also know
not that many people are watching that
full video it's a very small percentage
about 6 percent of people that go to
that page and I don't know which
percentage the percentage of those are
existing customers versus new but it is
persuasive no other theme does what I
show there that really shows you people
are wondering like Oh Gutenberg I can do
all this cool stuff with my posts I show
you how to destroy that with the simpler
editor with using basic focus stuff
could not be easier anyway
linking to that because I feel like it's
a you know very persuasive got you all
right and that's okay you want to drive
people deeper into the funnel so that
you have and
a lot of focus stuff and I'm just
picking and choosing the little pieces I
want to expose people to at this point
in the process right right right
top navigation is pretty simple and then
you have the the full menu or sorry the
yeah this is a full like navigation down
here right yeah part of that you know
part of that footer presence is for
legal concerns and also for search
engine optimization which we talked
about before we came on the air I have
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